Jean Touboul, CEO of Pernod Ricard India, highlighted the trend of premiumisation in the Indian spirits market, especially among younger consumers. Touboul also emphasised the importance of innovation in attracting consumers to higher-value products.
Category
🗞
NewsTranscript
00:00Let me welcome Jean Touboul, the CEO of Pernod Ricard India,
00:03one of the leading premium spirits brands in the world.
00:06Huge round of applause for Pernod Ricard India and for Jean Touboul.
00:11Warm welcome.
00:12Let me also welcome on stage Mr. Vivek Saini.
00:15He's the co-founder and chairman of Karma Ayurveda
00:19and he's been a premier and driving force in the India beauty and wellness space.
00:24Warm welcome to you as well, Vivek. Good to have you with us.
00:28And shortly, we will also be joined by Rahul Mishra,
00:31who's a visionary fashion designer and the first Indian to in fact showcase.
00:36He's walking right up the stage.
00:38Warm welcome to you and that's a great entry.
00:41You straight away walk up to this stage.
00:43Thank you so much, Rahul, for joining and making it on time.
00:46So, he's the first Indian to showcase at the Paris Haute Couture Week.
00:50Warm welcome to you, Rahul.
00:51And thank you so much, audiences, for being with us on this session.
00:53I promise, this is going to be a lot more interesting than you can imagine.
00:58I'm going to be starting off with you, Joan,
01:00and I want to start off by congratulating you.
01:03You must be in high spirits and I can say that because
01:05Pernod Ricard India has in fact become the largest alco-bev player in the country by revenues.
01:12So, congratulations on achieving that.
01:14I want to understand from you,
01:16where do you see India currently when it comes to premium spirits
01:19and where do we go from here when we come to talk about premium spirits?
01:24Why am I asking you this is India was earlier only thought about a mass market,
01:30you know, those who would be probably looking at lower ticket items when it comes to liquor,
01:35but you changed the game.
01:37How did you make that happen?
01:39Thank you again.
01:40And yes, indeed, we are very proud that we became the leader of this market
01:45after thirty years of presence locally.
01:48So, three decades is a long time and premiumization move towards luxury is a journey.
01:55It's a journey that started then and you're right to say there is still a big mass market
02:02with spirits in India, but it's premiumizing fast.
02:06It's premiumizing thanks to consumers who really are willing to aspire to products
02:13which are more elevated and with the spirits to drink less probably, but drink better stuff.
02:20And we see that which is extremely promising even more in the younger generation.
02:25And so, this trend is growing in the younger generation which means when they grow older,
02:31when their disposable income grows with life,
02:34we should see this trend continuing if not accelerating.
02:39Good afternoon.
02:40My first question to you is you to Rahul.
02:43Rahul, you're spearheading Indian luxury fashion on the global stage now.
02:46What are the key factors you think are responsible for achieving that?
02:51I think, when you think of luxury, like, you know, ultimate beauty of luxury lies in…
02:57I would say one factor we can define is time.
03:01So, how much time it takes to create something and how long it can retain love of the owner.
03:08So, these two factors define luxury.
03:11And somehow, when you think about India as a country,
03:14and I think I'm really lucky to be in India at this time
03:21and being a designer out of India where when you do Haute Couture Week in Paris,
03:26you realize almost ninety percent of most fabulous clothes which are showcased on runway
03:34are actually more or less made in India.
03:37So, I think it's idea India which is behind everything or
03:43which is reason behind whatever success we have got as a brand.
03:49Wonderful.
03:50I'll come to Vivek now and I want to understand from you, Vivek,
03:53you know, globally there is this rising trend of clean beauty
03:56and you're already at the helm of it.
03:58I want to still understand,
04:00do you think the recognition that we were hoping for Indian Ayurveda to achieve on a global stage
04:07in the luxury space has been delivered yet or still there is some bridge that needs to be gapped?
04:17Okay, so I think we're a long way to go.
04:21We're just… they're calling it A-beauty which is very nice.
04:26I love the idea of A-beauty.
04:28I said I love the idea of A-beauty.
04:30As to K-beauty, I think A is far better.
04:33We're, I think, at a very… still a very nascent stage.
04:37The… I think at Karma Ayurveda, what I'm very proud about is we took this idea of Ayurveda,
04:45a traditional Indian system of medicine and made it available to, well, an Indian audience
04:53and now a global audience with our stores in the UK.
04:57So, basically what was treated as a kitchen recipe,
05:01not a kitchen recipe but actually a science, not accessible to most people.
05:05The products that we make, kumkumadi thelam is a… kumkumadi is pretty household.
05:10You Google it now, I think there are like 10,000 kumkumadis up there.
05:13When we started twenty years ago, there wasn't even one.
05:16Ditch it with the hair oil.
05:18So, I think just the fact alone that the fact that we've popularized Ayurveda in that sense,
05:22I think that's extraordinary.
05:24By propagating Ayurveda in its most authentic way,
05:28which means using the best quality ingredients to get the highest level of efficacy.
05:34So, the products actually work.
05:35Your hair does stop falling, your dark circles do disappear,
05:38your acne, you know, skin, all of the stuff does get better.
05:43That's where we're premium.
05:44Actually not premium, we're luxury.
05:46And the world is now discovering it.
05:49It's also the sister science of yoga.
05:52So, I think with the prevalence of yoga all over the world,
05:54we're now finally coming to the time where Ayurveda is sort of coming into its…
05:58well, A-beauty is coming into its own.
06:01You said A-beauty and everybody is associating it with K-beauty.
06:04Why am I saying that?
06:05Because K-beauty has actually overtaken the world with the snail mucin and all those products.
06:09I want to know, when will A-beauty beat K-beauty on the global stage?
06:15I think K-beauty has been around for a while.
06:17So, just give A-beauty a chance.
06:18Yes, absolutely.
06:20A chance.
06:21And I think it's already very fast.
06:23I mean, it's kind of interesting.
06:24We opened in the UK two years ago, a year ago.
06:27And we're at Harrods and we're in Notting Hill.
06:29And I found that people have the same…
06:33like London has bad water and hard water and all their hair is falling out.
06:37So, they're using Brinjati hair oil and it's only growing.
06:40So, I'm quite excited about it.
06:42And now that we're talking about water, I'm going to shift to Mr. Tubal and ask him,
06:46what are the key growth drivers of the Indian spirit market?
06:49And how do you think PRI is innovating and going ahead in the curve?
06:54Innovation is key in our business,
06:58because if we want to continue to interest and attract consumers,
07:03to evolve them towards a product with more value,
07:07we need to deliver these values through innovation.
07:10So, we are constantly doing that,
07:12whether it is with our existing big brand like Rolstag,
07:18where we did Rolstag Double Dark recently, more PT.
07:23We did the Blender Sprite 4 elements that we launched.
07:25Or totally new to the world, the brand like Longitude 77,
07:30our own Indian single malt, which we launched 18 months ago.
07:35And which is a true elevation to the local whiskey markets.
07:41So, innovation with premiumization towards luxury.
07:46And also, if I could ask you, how do you collaborate between industries?
07:51Do you see yourself collaborating across industries?
07:55There is many collaboration, and we have Raul here.
07:59Our brand Blender Sprite works with fashion,
08:02and has been working with fashion for probably 20 years.
08:05So, we do see this association of lifestyle,
08:08when it goes to fashion, when sometime it goes to sports.
08:13Our brand, Shivas Regal, just announced a global partnership
08:17with Ferrari Scuderia, and also with Charles Leclerc, the pilot.
08:23So, this collaboration, this association are key to us,
08:27towards the two examples I mentioned are very luxury,
08:30towards this elevation, this lifestyle that our consumers are looking for.
08:35Raul, I'm going to come to you next.
08:37And, you know, John started to talk about innovation.
08:40I still want to ask you about fashion industry,
08:42which is considered as the most innovative industry.
08:45Nowadays, we're talking about digital and AI also in the fashion industry.
08:49So, I want to know from you, when we talk about, you know,
08:53very personal heritage, handmade, personal couture,
08:57can that continue to command value in this new tech-driven era,
09:01when AI is going to be looking to take over all the industries?
09:06You know, we all also keep asking this ourselves.
09:12And definitely, AI is a wave, which everybody, like,
09:17if you're not using AI tools, you might already be lagging behind, for sure.
09:22But I have to also share here something, like, think about,
09:26it's like late 18th century or early 19th, early 20th century.
09:32Clyde Monet is still there.
09:35And photography was taking over the world.
09:37Somehow, most of the artists,
09:39they were making money by making portraits of rich people.
09:43Suddenly, photography is there.
09:45There's no longer requirement for so many artists.
09:49But art kept appreciating.
09:52Like, recently, one of the artwork of Monet and one of Picasso,
09:57which has auctioned a record value,
09:59which is, I think, close to 50 million or something like that, one piece.
10:03So, yeah, anything which is handmade, which is driven with purpose,
10:07which is driven with the idea of heritage,
10:10is going to become far more relevant in the time of AI,
10:14because things are going to be made far more faster.
10:18So, power of hand is here to stay.
10:20And I really feel, when you look at a country like India,
10:23which is 1.5 billion population, is better stays here,
10:29because that's also a requirement of society.
10:31Absolutely. So, Rahul, I want to just follow up with that.
10:33You did say that the power of hand is here to stay.
10:36I want to just bring up, to speed, the memory of all the people.
10:40You designed Isha Ambani's Met Kala look,
10:43and that became a viral,
10:44and people will be able to see that picture behind me soon.
10:49But, Rahul, 10,000 handmade hours is what it took
10:53to make that beautiful, gorgeous gown, tell us.
10:57How did you get that done?
10:58And what conversation with Isha Ambani really got that final look?
11:02So, you know, the theme was, you know, garden of time.
11:11So, it is called garden of time.
11:12If you look at like, our studio, Rahul Bishra's studio,
11:16actually has created gardens across many seasons.
11:21You know, many years we have been working with florals,
11:24all these things,
11:26working with florals, all these embroidery experiments and all that.
11:30So, in that way, what we have done,
11:32we have created almost like a life of a garden.
11:37In her gown, the beginning of the gown starts with,
11:40you know, with almost like dead flowers.
11:44So, when a flower dies, it's not real death,
11:47it's a beginning, it's a new beginning.
11:49So, that is something depicted with golden color.
11:52And how it kind of moves forward,
11:54the entire palla was, you know, multiple feet long.
11:58And the whole idea was as if like it's a floating river
12:01and how, you know, flowers are kind of floating onto it.
12:06So, you know, it was also a lot of sample flowers
12:10which you have done across ten years of time.
12:13Everything has gone into it.
12:15A lot of recycling, repurposing has gone into creating that outfit.
12:19And that was a whole idea which she also wanted.
12:23So, this palla which you see here,
12:26all different flowers from different seasons.
12:29Almost like, you know, a time of ten years we have put together.
12:34And her piece which is more closer to body
12:38is gold and these brown, you know, dead skeleton of flowers which is there.
12:44So, as if like, you know, death is a new beginning or a new beginning of life.
12:51So, that's our whole idea was.
12:52Moderator Thank you.
12:54Vivek, my next question is to you.
12:55And I would like to ask you about,
12:58now Kama Ayurveda has ventured as an international footprint in the UK.
13:02What are the key initiatives undertaken by the brand to raise awareness
13:05among the global consumer
13:07on India's traditional holistic approach to beauty and wellness?
13:10Vivek So, you know, I can't speak about India,
13:14but I can speak about Ayurveda.
13:16And I think the most important thing is reason to believe.
13:20Like, you know, I can say this is saffron is amazing or this ingredient works,
13:24but how, why?
13:25I mean, what is my reason to believe you?
13:27And that's why we turn to science.
13:30So, clinical trials.
13:33Clinical trials with detailed efficiency in the labs.
13:37We, the clinical trials here and in both in Europe.
13:39So, two sets of trials to prove this science,
13:43what was codified 2,500 years ago.
13:46The kumkumadi has been around for centuries.
13:48So, it's time tested.
13:50So, what is time tested in India has been proven by science that it actually works.
13:55So, clinically proven 21 day use, your hair does stop falling,
13:59your dandruff does get reduced,
14:01your acne does clear up,
14:03your dark circles do get reduced.
14:05So, I think the science was the key,
14:07that we use science to prove this ancient,
14:10well, modern science to prove the ancient science.
14:13Modern science to prove the ancient science.
14:17And I think, you know, once you have,
14:18I think the proof, as I say,
14:19proof of the pudding is in the eating.
14:22If you actually have a product that works,
14:23I think that's reason enough to buy.
14:26What is going to be the next big product
14:28after kumkumadi, you know, such a viral success?
14:31Well, we've got a bunch and actually we've got a whole bunch new,
14:34we've got something very interesting happening early April.
14:37A whole bunch of new things,
14:39which I won't speak about now,
14:41but you'll be hearing about them shortly.
14:42So, a whole bunch of very exciting new things happening.
14:45Okay, John, I'm going to come to you
14:47and I want to ask you about the regulatory policies
14:50in the Alkobev industry that can be very tricky and tough,
14:53especially when it varies across the states.
14:55Is it really difficult for you to navigate such challenges
14:58when it comes as headwinds to your overall ambition,
15:01growth, aspirations in India?
15:06Well, Alkobev market is regulated all over the world.
15:09So, we don't complain and we acknowledge alcohol is not neutral
15:14and we accept this regulation and the taxation that goes with it.
15:18Fair to say that India is complex
15:20and this regulation, which is different in the different states,
15:24does create some difficulties.
15:26But we are a large player, the largest.
15:30We do cooperate well with the different authorities
15:34and I would say the situation is improving year after year.
15:36So, I'm really looking at this increasing ease of doing business,
15:41which is the right path.
15:43Of course, I would like it to go even faster,
15:46but it's going into the right direction.
15:50Rahul, my question is to you.
15:52You know, as you said before, the Indian artisan is in the spotlight,
15:55whether it is Chanel, which produces the embroidery here,
15:58Dior, as we've seen before.
16:00We recently saw Dries Van Noten doing all the embroidery in India
16:03and finally giving it the due that it received, needed to be.
16:07And what do you feel about the Indian artisan being in the spotlight
16:09and how do you take it forward on the global stage?
16:13You know, I really feel like there's some hard realities, like
16:21one of the reasons why till now the craft is alive,
16:24there are two reasons behind it.
16:26One is, which is again celebration of Indian consumers,
16:30especially Indian women, who end up buying a lot of craft.
16:35They value, they understand it, they consume it.
16:39And second reason, which is also India is such a large country,
16:43everybody does not have proper employment.
16:48So in that way, creating like, for example, a handloom weaver
16:51who is weaving from the village,
16:53because, you know, till now we could not take work to their doorstep,
16:59to the weavers.
17:01And average weaver, even till date also,
17:04earns sometimes 5,000, less than 5,000 rupees, you know, a month.
17:09So in that way, more designers, whether global or Indian,
17:14more we work with purity of hand.
17:16Again, I say, why I use the word purity of hand?
17:19Because a lot of work which is happening is also semi-mechanized.
17:23Maybe a little computer embroidery and put a little bit of 10% hand embroidery
17:27on their sails is a handmade lehenga.
17:29I think that is where we all brands, like all of us,
17:33why I'm using this forum to talk about this,
17:36all the brands, we all need a kind of responsibility also
17:42to make sure if you can, if you have a customer who's ready to pay price,
17:47it is better to create something which is purely out of hand.
17:50Otherwise, the entire idea of luxury goes just in optics of things.
17:56And how can we make sure that fair wages are given,
18:00due credit is given to everybody?
18:03So this is something which I really feel a lot of times,
18:05like when I had some meeting with Mr. Textile also,
18:09I was talking about how can you make sure
18:11even somebody who's working from their home
18:14and multiple craftsmen still across all industries,
18:18you know, across whether it's related to Vivek,
18:23somebody doing something in Kannauj or somebody doing something in…
18:25So a lot of these people when they work from home,
18:28how can we make sure when they work for eight hours a day,
18:31how at least minimum wages, if not sustainable wages,
18:35first dream is that everybody gets to get minimum wages
18:38for their work to be done.
18:41So in that way, I really feel the idea of luxury
18:44becomes far more powerful as a tool because,
18:48you know, as a designer, I always feel
18:49what is the purpose behind making another outfit?
18:51You know, I would really love to create some garments,
18:55maybe without embroidery one day and I really want to
18:58and that's how I started my career.
19:00But the thing is, embroidery is such a slow process,
19:04it employs so many people,
19:06so purpose for us is how do you create more participation
19:09from people who really need work?
19:12So this becomes almost like a kind of,
19:15you know, continuous cycle for us to look at luxury,
19:20not necessarily in minimalism but celebrate maximalism
19:25because it creates more employment,
19:26it's more purposeful for society.
19:29And sustainability wise, I always say it,
19:31you know, you might grow organic cotton,
19:36best material possible but, you know,
19:39when you make a million of t-shirts like that,
19:41it's no longer sustainable.
19:43On the other hand, using plastic sequin with hand
19:47on an outfit which is going to stay like that forever,
19:51which you passed on as heirloom piece in generations,
19:54might be far more sustainable, you know,
19:57because materiality is one thing of sustainability.
19:59Look at social sustainability,
20:01look at cultural sustainability,
20:03look at also how certain techniques somebody has mastered
20:07and they need to be employed with those.
20:09Barkha Dutt Absolutely.
20:10John, I'm going to come to you.
20:11My last question to you, we're running out of time now.
20:14I want to understand Pernod Ricard India's focus
20:16now going forward from here.
20:18So far, like we began discussing,
20:20your focus has been more premium,
20:22your focus has been limited editions as well.
20:24Tell me, would you ever want to explore
20:27or expand in the mass market
20:28or maybe look at exploring even the brood segments and spirits?
20:32Wineries, you shut down,
20:34are you going to be looking at that yet again?
20:36Pernod Ricard The simple answer is,
20:39we are a premium spirit company.
20:41So the mass market, some other people do it very well
20:44and it's not really our business.
20:47We prefer to attract the consumer and bring them up.
20:52And we are a local company
20:55and I think there is more and more demand for local spirits.
20:59Take Indian single malt.
21:0015, 20 years ago, you bring a friend home
21:04and you propose him an Indian single malt,
21:06he will question friendship with you.
21:08Nowadays, they will love it.
21:10We have plenty of good products in the market
21:13and I think that's the way forward for the market.
21:15Q My last question to you, Vivek.
21:17There's been an influx of beauty products in the country today,
21:21especially skincare is on a rise.
21:23How do you stay true to the ethos of the brand
21:25and do not become a part of the clutter?
21:28Vivek I think the most important thing
21:31is authenticity and sticking to the value system you started with.
21:37Because it's very easy to become trend-driven
21:41but then you lose the spirit of what you are.
21:44And we are not a trend-driven company.
21:45Ayurveda is not trend-driven.
21:47And so if we're selling traditional and authentic Ayurveda,
21:50we stick to the authenticity of Ayurveda,
21:53so you don't dilute it.
21:55Obviously, you create more modern ways of utilization,
21:58of using it and consumer use
22:00because obviously nobody wants to just only put in oil.
22:04They might want to use a cream which is diluted.
22:07But I think authenticity is critical.
22:09Q Thank you, everybody.
22:12And thank you all the audiences for listening in.
22:15You've been great and fascinating insights being shared.
22:17Thank you, Rahul, Vivek and John for that insightful conversation.