Tariffs against Chinese-made EVs 'guarantee a level playing field Innovation minister
Tariffs against Chinese-made EVs 'guarantee a level playing field Innovation minister
Transcript
00:00Today in Halifax, Justin Trudeau top ministers are planning how to handle the relationship regardless of who wins that presidential election
00:07There's a cabinet retreat as it's known as going on in Halifax. It wraps up today. CTV's Vashi Kapelos is on the ground
00:14She's our chief political correspondent
00:15She's been talking with Canada's minister of industry who is one of the Trudeau government's top members
00:21Of course on team Trudeau and she's standing by in Halifax with more Vashi
00:30Hi, yes, I am here on the concluding day of the retreat in Halifax and next to me is cabinet minister minister of industry and innovation and a whole host of other things
00:41Francois-Philippe Champagne. Good to see you. Thank you for making the time.
00:44Well, thank you for having me.
00:45I wanted to start off in the context of two things. First of all, the announcement that came yesterday on tariffs on Chinese EVs and steel and aluminum
00:52But against the backdrop of the team that you're a part of this Team Canada approach in particular
00:56I wanted to know did Canada have any other choice given the fact that the United States had levied these tariffs and wanted Canada to do the same to do it?
01:05Like did you have any other choice but to pull the trigger?
01:07Well, the choice was to make sure we have a level playing field that that was really the reason because on one end, you know, we believe in free trade
01:14I was minister of international trade, but on the other end you have a country like China who does not apply the same rules
01:22So obviously we say if you have unfair trading practice, we need to react. We're going to protect our workers
01:27We're going to protect our industry. We're going to protect Canadians
01:29So that was really the thinking behind is that if you're not going to be abiding by the rules of trade
01:35We will have to make sure that we have tariffs in place
01:38And I think for me, that's good news for, you know, if you ask the workers and the steel, aluminum and the EV sector
01:43That was the right thing to do, but also the smart thing to do because if you put rules and you have someone who doesn't respect them, then you have to react
01:51Would you have reacted had the United States not acted first? Would you have done this without them starting it?
01:57Well, obviously you have a market, especially on the auto sector. It's one market in North America
02:02But you have our friends in Europe, which have also put tariffs on EV vehicles coming from China
02:06So in a sense, it's not just Canada. It's kind of a number of countries who have said, hold on for a minute
02:13We may want to do free trade, but trade has to be equal in a sense
02:17You have to respect the rules. If you don't, because you do overcapacity, you oversubsidize the industry
02:23You're doing a number of things that are not in line with trading practices
02:28Then obviously you have to react to protect our industry
02:31And my job is to fight for Canadian workers, Canadian industry every day and Canadian consumers as well
02:36And I think at the end of the day, people understand if they have a choice
02:40They want to have a car which is made with the highest labor standard, environmental standard
02:44They want to support our Canadian industry
02:46We just subtracted some of the biggest generational investments in our country
02:50We're going to be protecting them and we're going to make sure we have jobs for generations to come
02:54But when it comes to those consequences, for example, the EVs
02:58My understanding is the vast majority are Teslas
03:01Tesla can move production to the United States and thereby avoid the tariffs
03:05What about batteries? What about solar cells?
03:07Are you not pulling the trigger at this juncture on that simply because we are very reliant on China?
03:13Basically, were you insulated enough to make this decision but not enough on the component parts?
03:17Well, we always have to stand up for Canadian interests
03:19That's the starting base
03:21So why not stand up for the interests of those who make batteries and solar cells?
03:24Well, we're standing up for those who are making batteries
03:27There will be consultation on other things that are coming
03:30But just to your point on Tesla, yes, Tesla were made in California before
03:33And they shifted production in Shanghai and I bet they'll bring production back to California
03:38It's a good thing
03:40We'll have Tesla made in North America for Canadians
03:43When it comes to standing up for making sure we protect our industry and we have a level playing field
03:49I think Canadians fundamentally, they understand fairness
03:52They say, well, it has to be fair
03:53And that's what we did yesterday
03:55People want to see people who are fighting, people who are delivering and taking action
03:59And clearly, we started with steel, aluminum and obviously the EV vehicle
04:04But as you've seen, we said we're going to have consultation on other strategic products
04:09to make sure that do China respect the trade rules that are in place?
04:14Yes or no?
04:15The United States has already concluded in those cases that they don't
04:18What evidence do you have that they might?
04:20And are you, again, I'll repeat the portion of the question
04:23Are you not acting at this juncture on those parts because they are too reliant on Chinese inputs
04:29and it would be too risky whereas Tesla could move that production elsewhere?
04:33Well, I would say we're going to have consultation
04:35To your point, that's the Canadian way
04:37We consulted the industry, we consulted
04:40You just consulted for two months
04:41Why couldn't you ask this question then?
04:43Well, no, but we're going to have further consultation on other products
04:47When it comes to EV cars and when it comes to steel and aluminum, we have concluded that
04:51But we said on other products that are strategic, we're going to be doing consultation
04:55We talked with our American friends, we talked with our friends in Europe
04:58Listen
04:59You don't have any inherent hesitation to levying additional tariffs
05:02if at the end of that consultation it's concluded
05:04I don't want to forego any conclusion
05:06We're going to be consulting and making a decision at the right time
05:09But I think what was imminent, people, we needed to make timely, decisive action
05:14with respect to EV vehicle and steel and aluminum
05:17That was very clear
05:18The rest we're going to be consulting
05:20And like I said, this is good news for Canadian workers and Canadian industry
05:24and Canadians in general because people believe in fairness
05:28If the trade practice of another country are not fair, we're going to react
05:31More broadly, when it comes to the relationship with Canada and the United States
05:35which of course you've been very involved with when it comes to Team Canada
05:38The outrage to various governors, I think 33 different states between the three of you
05:43The ambassador was saying today
05:45We spoke to David McNaughton, who's presenting to you later this afternoon
05:48And he told us that essentially, it's one thing to promise to do things to help your neighbor in the future
05:54It's another thing, and what he thinks is necessary, to do things right now
05:58And particularly, he was talking about spending on defense
06:01You're the Minister of Industry, you oversee a number of different industries
06:04But you know a lot about procurement in this country and defense spending
06:08Is there merit to that argument?
06:11And Bill Morneau made it to me last week at the DNC
06:14Should we be spending more on defense faster?
06:17Well, I think the challenge of how you invest
06:20I'd rather use the word invest in spending, is not unique
06:23I was at a conference with NATO and other G7 and other countries
06:27And I can tell you, how you deploy that money successfully and efficiently
06:32To get the products you need is not only a challenge that we have here
06:35But I would say across NATO countries
06:37In a sense, there's a question of capacity of industries
06:42Not only in Canada, in the United States and Europe
06:44Because as you've seen, the spending on defense has been increasing
06:47And now people are saying, how can we make sure we have efficient procurement?
06:51And that's something that we are talking not only internally, but with our U.S. friends
06:55But just to be very specific, have you taken steps that help the Americans?
06:59Very much. I'll give you just one example, semiconductors
07:02You know when the Americans put the CHIPS Act in place
07:0580% of all the semiconductors which are manufactured in the U.S.
07:10Are packaged and tested in Canada
07:11They're small compared to what's done in Taiwan
07:13I would say about 80% of all the semiconductors manufactured
07:17Are packaged and tested in Canada
07:19My point is that when they did that
07:22We said, if you invest in manufacturing, we'll invest in packaging and testing
07:25Not only me saying that, but President Biden when he came to the House of Commons
07:29Highlighted that the American and Canadian need to work together
07:33To have more resiliency on something as key as semiconductor
07:36Which is the DNA of progress
07:38I'm certainly not saying Canada's doing nothing
07:40I think the point is around particularly security
07:42Which we've heard a number of Republicans be outspoken on
07:45I understand that finally Canada put forward as the last ally to do so
07:48A plan to reach 2% by 2032
07:51Mr. McNaughton, who's a friend of the Liberal government
07:54Is saying out loud, do that faster
07:57So is Bill Morneau, who was a Liberal finance minister
08:00Is that something that's off the table?
08:02Everyone wants to go fast, but they also want to do efficient
08:05Like I said today, it's not just about the money
08:08It's the production capacity, trust me
08:10Isn't that your government's job too, to figure that out as well?
08:12I would say yeah, but it's just, trust me, it's not just Canada
08:15You talk to American suppliers, you talk to European suppliers
08:18Because you've seen every NATO country said we need to increase spending
08:22Now you basically have to match the spending level with the production level
08:27And that's the discussion we have with a number of partners
08:30Who are manufacturing that equipment
08:32Our capacity issues with procurement predate the past few years
08:37You're right that all countries, industrialized countries
08:39Are having issues with it right now
08:41But our capacity issues aren't unique to this period in time
08:44They predate it, and even to be fair, predate your government
08:46I would say it's true also in a number of our partners
08:49To be honest, when you look at the last 20 years
08:52And you look at the spending on defense
08:54Because of the 2% that you've seen
08:56And a number of NATO countries doing that at the same time
08:58Clearly now, when we had a discussion
09:00I remember everyone said we're all facing the same thing
09:03You want to invest, you want to invest also in things that we need
09:06And we want to do that efficiently
09:08And we want to have benefits for our workers and our industry
09:10So I would say the amount is something
09:13Then we need to match that with the production capacity
09:16That we can muster, I would say, in NATO countries
09:19So in the absence of that capacity, is it off the table then
09:22To try and accelerate the spending?
09:24No, but you're trying to do as much as possible
09:27But at the same time, it needs to be efficient
09:29In response to the need of the military
09:31And that's why you're talking
09:33I even suggested recently that we look at NATO procurement
09:36Because we're all looking at the same thing
09:38And honestly, the type of thing we want
09:41Is the same thing that other NATO countries want
09:43But I guess, from my perspective
09:45Is procurement just something off to the side
09:47That somebody else has to figure out?
09:49Isn't that the responsibility of the federal government
09:51To make sure that's possible?
09:53Putting aside the capacity issues
09:55Procurement itself, the process here is problematic
09:57Well, but I would just say that
09:59I think as Canadians, we tend to be a bit critical of ourselves
10:02Look at other NATO countries
10:04Everyone is facing the same thing
10:06On procurement and industrial capacity
10:08Obviously, my job is to make sure
10:10That we have the industrial capacity
10:12To match our needs that we want
10:14At the speed we want it
10:16And the way to do that, we've been talking to allies
10:18And partners, Jake Sullivan was here recently
10:20As you've seen, I can tell you
10:22There's thoughts at NATO
10:24How can we procure better, faster, cheaper?
10:26And Canada is an integral part of that
10:28Because the money is something
10:30But you need to buy the right thing
10:32At the right price in the right place
10:34And that's our job, I appreciate on the procurement
10:36But we're talking also with industry
10:38To say, hey, by the way, everyone needs to gear up
10:40Because now you have that spending and defence
10:42That we need to match
10:44And have the production capacity
10:46I've got time for one more question
10:48I'm going to make it political in nature
10:50Because it is about the comparisons with the US
10:52I know you've been listening the past three days
10:54I know the question doesn't come as a surprise
10:56But everybody's looking down there and seeing
10:58Joe Biden stepped aside, Kamala Harris stepped in
11:00And the Democrats benefited
11:02Should Justin Trudeau do the same thing?
11:04What does that mean?
11:06They want people like me and others to fight
11:08They want people like me and others in Cabinet to deliver
11:10They want me and others and the Prime Minister
11:12To take action
11:14I think what we saw yesterday in the tariff
11:16Is exactly the type of thing that Canadians want to see
11:18They say there's a problem, take action
11:20Fight for me, that's what we're doing
11:22And I would say hope is contagious
11:24So you're going to see me and my colleagues coming in Ottawa
11:26When we're back on the streets
11:28And I would say the best thing that we can bring
11:30Is to bring hope, talk about possibility
11:32And opportunities for Canada
11:34And I think, you know, make sure that Canadians
11:36Feel the same momentum that we feel
11:38To make sure that we build for the 21st century
11:40But the fact is they're not
11:42If you look at public opinion polling
11:44And even put polls aside, the results in the Toronto by-election
11:46It would appear they don't believe
11:48Necessarily that you're fighting
11:50Or that you can deliver on the possibilities
11:52That you're outlining now
11:54And you've had nine years to do that
11:56How do you address that sentiment?
11:58Well, we need to do more
12:00I'm not saying you want more of the same
12:02But I'm saying we need
12:04And we're putting a vision for the country
12:06A vision which is about possibility, opportunities
12:08And to your point, you know
12:10When you talk about cost of living
12:12Fight for the issues that are faced by everyday Canadians
12:14Housing is one of the things we talked about
12:16After that we've been talking
12:18With respect to immigration
12:20Those are the things that people care about
12:22They've cared about them for years
12:24And you're just acting on them now
12:26Well, I think people want to see people who fight
12:28That's the sentiment
12:30At least that's what I'm going to bring
12:32Fighting for the issues faced by every Canadian
12:34Make sure we talk about hope
12:36And opportunities and possibility
12:38And again, you know
12:40When you look at Canada
12:42We have the people
12:44We have the natural resources
12:46We have the energy
12:48We've been blessed by geography
12:50Listen, in a world like that
12:52Where you're talking about decarbonization
12:54And AI coming up
12:56For us to bring that to Canadians
12:58We're going to fight, you're going to win
13:00And we're going to do that together
13:02Minister, a pleasure as always
13:04Thank you so much