Prior to the Congressional recess, during a Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing, Sen. Chris Coons (D-DE) questioned Deputy Secretary of State Kurt Campbell about the role of the US and China in Africa, as well as US support for Ukraine.
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00:00Senator Coons. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you so much for your leadership on
00:04shaping our policies with regards to China and the rest of the world. And thank you for investing
00:10your time in going to the African continent and seeing this critical sphere of competition,
00:17of potential conflict between the United States and China. Let me just first ask about partners
00:22and allies. I think President Biden's leadership in responding to Russia's aggression in Ukraine,
00:28pulling together, strengthening and expanding NATO, mobilizing 50 countries,
00:33including in the Indo-Pacific, to support Ukraine has been critical. How relevant
00:38is it to our global competition with China that we continue to support Ukraine, that we send
00:46a strong and consistent and bipartisan message that when we say we're with Ukraine, we mean it?
00:54Thanks, Senator. And I want to thank you for your leadership on this.
00:57I will just simply say that before the state visit of Prime Minister Kishida,
01:04he had an opportunity to appear before Congress and give a major address. It surprised people
01:10that the number one issue that he raised and asked the American people in Congress to do
01:16was to stand by Ukraine, to continue the job. And it does suggest we think of Europe and the
01:22Indo-Pacific as separate theaters. We should not. They are strategically aligned. Everyone
01:29in the Indo-Pacific is watching how Ukraine turns out. The United States standing firmly
01:36with allies and partners, being unequivocal in our support for Ukraine, gives courage and a sense
01:46of determination to our allies and partners. In my recent visit to Taiwan, following their
01:52election to the Shangri-La conference in Singapore, I got exactly the same sense. Yes,
01:57standing firm with the Philippines and the second Thomas Shoal was critical for the region.
02:02But if we step back one inch from supporting Ukraine, that sends an even stronger message
02:06and something that there is some real risk that in our elections this fall, the message
02:12will go out that we have national leaders who don't support Ukraine.
02:16Could I say just one other thing, Senator? I also wanted to personally thank you for the
02:20encouragement to engage directly on Africa. So I've been in the job five months. I've been
02:25to Africa twice. I will go a third time. And I will tell you quite directly, it's the part of
02:31my job that I feel the strongest about and I'm most committed to. And I asked for the support
02:37of this group. So I would say we need more in a couple of different arenas. I think more in terms
02:45of our ability at the DFC and the Millennium Challenge account, more congressional visits.
02:51You'd be amazed at how much some of these small countries appreciate. And I got to just tell you,
02:56like Africa right now, we have 14 NOMs that are waiting for votes across the continent. And I
03:04would just simply say, I think it helps us in terms of really making the case for Americans.
03:10Let me pick a relatively obscure one. Eswatini, formerly known as Swaziland,
03:15one of the very few countries on the continent that still maintains relations with Taiwan,
03:19not the PRC. We don't have an ambassador. We haven't had an ambassador. There have been major
03:24challenges in terms of human rights and other issues. Without an ambassador, we're just absent.
03:29This is true across a dozen other, 14 to be specific, major countries across the continent.
03:35Russia's there. China's there. The scope of China's trade with Africa has increased tenfold
03:42in the time I've been here, while ours has barely grown. Their trade with Africa,
03:46$240 billion last year. Ours now, just $48 billion. How important is the timely reauthorization of
03:52AGOA for us to use the tools of trade in Africa? I think it's critical. And there's a lot of
03:59gamesmanship about whether to wait, and I would get it done. I think it's one of the few tools
04:06I'd get it done. Before I run out of time, if I could, we just moved out of the Appropriations
04:11Committee with a very strong bipartisan vote this year's state and foreign operations.
04:16It includes an investment in a countering PRC influence fund, $425 million. It includes
04:22significant aid for Ukraine for the coming year. Not what they need, but hundreds of millions of
04:27dollars. It importantly includes a new fund that allows Treasury to leverage the multilateral
04:33development banks that will unlock more than $4 billion in more transparent, more effective,
04:39higher standard investing in infrastructure so that we can directly compete with China's
04:43Belt and Road Initiative on the continent and around the world. It invests in our workforce
04:48at the UN and all the different UN entities where the Chinese have grown and grown and grown their
04:53influence. And it invests in combating corruption. When we say we need to have and we must have a
04:59foreign policy that reflects our values, whether it's in the Caribbean, the Global South, Africa,
05:06it's important for us to stand up for democracy and human rights, but it's also important for
05:11us to combat corruption. Because one of the biggest features of China's foreign policy
05:16is buying and extending their influence through corruption. The average person in the Global South
05:21sees the resources of their country being stolen to benefit their national leaders.
05:28The fight for critical minerals and the fight for supply chains is essential and this is one
05:32other area we can't neglect. I'm just going to say one thing if I can quickly that I agree with
05:38everything that you've said. I will say I was in Senegal about two weeks ago. I was able, very proudly
05:44able to go to a project site which was just being launched, backed by the DFC. And just for folks
05:51that don't understand why that is important, most of African financing are projects from China.
05:59Chinese bring their own laborers in. They do not allow for very much training. They're secretive.
06:05There's a lot of corruption. This particular project, all Senegalese-based workers,
06:14capacity building, everything, this was our partnership with them. And I will tell you,
06:21being able to see the commitment of, this is French Africa, we struggle there sometimes
06:29to build influence, but it was substantial commitment. And so I just want to fully support
06:34the ability to leverage financing the DFC and also do debt-backed finance, incredibly important.
06:45I think this is a very good use of capital and engagement. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
06:51Let me just observe. I thank Senator Coons and Senator Graham for your work on the appropriations
06:57issues. I just make an observation. The caps that you've been given are unrealistically low,
07:03particularly USAID numbers. There are cuts this year and that's unfortunate.
07:10It's just not a large enough pie, but I thank you for the work that you've done.