The power of football to help mental health
Mark Carruthers speaks to Matthew Smith, founder of suicide prevention charity If U Care Share, about the power of football in positively impacting mental health.
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00:00Hi, I'm Mark Crothers. I'm here with If You Care, Share Foundation co-founder Matthew Smith.
00:05Matthew, looking at If You Care, Share, can you give us an idea of the services
00:08you provide in the North East and around the country?
00:11Yeah, so If You Care, Share has been around for 13 years now, registered in 2011,
00:20with the three aims of preventing suicide, training people on how to intervene with
00:24somebody who might be suicidal, while also supporting those that have been affected by
00:29suicide. We offer support to people who have been affected across the North East and we also
00:36deliver various different parts of training, some of which is elsewhere in the country,
00:42working in partnership with the likes of the Premier League and the Football League.
00:45Matthew, we look at football, the importance it has in all of our lives as men
00:50and women and children. We look at how it gets people talking. There's an interesting contrast
00:56with mental health and opening up about mental health there.
00:59Yeah, there is and I think we're seeing it more and more of actually how football plays a part
01:07in everybody's mental health. I think we always box mental health off as a negative thing,
01:16when clearly it's not. It's something we're all dealing with and football can play a huge
01:21part in that and how we're feeling in terms of having a good day, a bad day, based on a result.
01:26But I think, for me, one of the big challenges that we always find around mental health is how
01:32we have these conversations. I think football is a bridge, can be a bridge, because we do
01:43express our emotions in a way we probably wouldn't elsewhere. There's so many attachments
01:52with the make between football and mental health and I think football has took some
01:57real responsibility in having conversations around it and you've seen so many amazing campaigns.
02:03I think my big challenge now is though that we've done a lot around the importance of talking.
02:10Maybe we need to think more about actually how we listen, how we spot signs and how we support
02:15other people. Because we stereotype blokes and we say they can't talk and my argument is,
02:22in the right environment and if they feel comfortable enough, they will. Are we creating
02:27all the right environments and are we listening in the right ways? But I do feel that football is
02:34kind of moving with and sometimes ahead of the times with it. It's been quite interesting in
02:39recent years, hasn't it? Because a number of players have come out and said that they're
02:42struggling with their mental health and are going through a great time. A couple have come out and
02:45said they're suffering from depression and anxiety. Do you feel a reaction to them though?
02:50Because I look at this and think the reaction's been, I wouldn't say overwhelmingly positive,
02:55but it has been more positive than negative. Do you think we're making progress in that sense?
02:59100%. So I've worked delivering mental health workshops in football for 12 years and I always
03:07remember early on when I was doing that saying we won't get a current footballer taught about
03:14their mental health battles. You were seeing the ex-players come out and you know we've had some
03:20real tragedies within football but actually the one spoke out and there was a real supportive
03:28reaction and I think the snowball effect is going down the hill and we are seeing players that have
03:37taken time out to look after their mental health. We are seeing players openly speaking about the
03:42challenges that they've had and then going on to flourish and really achieve and I think for
03:51somebody as a fan seeing that, the biggest thing for a person is being able to look at somebody
03:58and think, oh I'm not alone, I'm not the only person that's felt that. And to see somebody
04:05where you have the perception that they have everything, which clearly they don't, but to see
04:10them still be vulnerable and say, do you know what I have struggled, almost legitimises, okay well
04:17actually what I'm feeling is normal. We're seeing more and more groups coming up about
04:24speaking about your mental health and coming together as groups, as blokes, as communities, so
04:30there's huge huge positives I think that has come out and I think it's huge
04:38bravery to the players but I think that makes it a bigger thing than it is because
04:43yes it takes huge bravery but actually it should be normalised, it should be
04:48normalised that we can say, do you know what I'm not okay and I think we are going towards that
04:56but you know there are still so many people that are struggling in silence unfortunately.
05:01I'll say this with as much self-awareness as I can but we are sat here in the shadow of St
05:06James's Park, it's what now 12, 13 years since we lost Gary Speed to suicide.
05:13Certain sections of the media didn't cover themselves in glory in the aftermath of that
05:16but do you feel, we speak about progress in wider society, do you feel as if the media's made
05:21progress in how they report on suicide and mental health?
05:25I think they've learned, I think they've, I look back and you know we've seen it in
05:34different instances not related to suicide but you know there is always a enticement for a story
05:43but I think there has been real progress and I think also you know charities have held
05:49media platforms to account and understood the severity of some of the things that they may
05:56have reported and what that could potentially mean in the future so I definitely think that
06:01there is strides in the right direction however I do still feel that there is more accountability
06:08that can be taken on how do we be more supportive for people that are here, you know.
06:14Education.
06:15Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think education but also you know we've seen it so many times with
06:21athletes, with players, with individuals where they can be
06:26held to account over things that may have not even happened so I do think there's still always that
06:35more empathy that's needed for the potential impact on somebody but
06:39yeah there's positive steps, there's definitely positive steps.
06:42Do we feel there's a generational thing going on here where the older generation,
06:47with all due respect to any older generation that are watching, where they have been that more sort
06:52of stoic, you know keep it inside, you know can't show any weakness which it would have been seen
06:57as maybe when they were younger but now we've seen maybe the next generation because of footballers
07:02you know who we could name who've said they're struggling, they've got anxiety because high
07:07profile figures have come out and do that, do we feel as if the next generation may well be
07:11a bit more open to without fear of being accused of being woke, seems to be the interim
07:18phrase at the moment? I mean yes but that hasn't just happened by fluke, by chance,
07:25that's happened because of education, you know. I can say that with a very kind of open heart
07:33because we have played a very small part in that in terms of the investment that's been put into
07:39young players to make sure that they're an all-rounded person. Yes the goal is to be an
07:45athlete but actually what we're talking about is young people so it doesn't happen by chance
07:51though you know we're seeing it more within the education system but we're not there but
07:57the only way we'll make a significant change around people talking is by education and normalising
08:03the things that don't necessarily feel normal but I'll go back to we can just keep telling people
08:12to talk but we also need that support and that system in place to make sure that people are
08:20getting the right help and the time that they need it and we're not there, we're not there with that.
08:26I was finding really interesting that football which is such a tribal environment, such a tribal
08:31sport that it can provide that environment where people can come together and can talk and you know
08:37I've had, I don't mind saying, I've had conversations with mates when we've been at games together and
08:41we both spoke about football and then it leads on to a conversation about how you do and it's
08:47quite strange how that environment of what can be quite an angry environment can allow you to open
08:52up in that sense because those conversations led on to and I'm not great at the moment if I'm honest
08:57and we both opened up about issues in our life at the time and go back a few years now but
09:02I always find that contrast quite strange. Yeah but I think we're, it's back to that kind of
09:10education we haven't been built to openly share our emotions you know me and you sat here
09:17actually if we just sat here and had a conversation around our emotions some people would find,
09:23most people would find that really difficult. I think even little things the idea of the fact that
09:28he's aren't even making eye contact because he's watching the game and there's something else going
09:31on but also it's based on a comfort level, it's based on an environment and a community
09:38that you feel you're part of and I think this is where I feel really passionate about like
09:45we have to be more, we can't expect people to come to us, we've got to go where they're already
09:51having the conversations and football is a great example of that and you know we've talked
09:57about the power that football has but the strength of the community as well you know the northeast
10:04for me what we are best at is community and coming together when there's crisis and you see that so
10:10many times unfortunately when somebody's being lost to suicide and there's always that if only
10:15they'd said and we could have supported them and we have to keep using the power that we have
10:21in our communities in football to support each other through horrendous challenging times.
10:28There's a number of clubs, I say a number, quite a lot of clubs have helped if you can share
10:34foundation's annual Inside Out program initiative and campaign. When I look at certain things
10:42clubs have done, Norwich City did a really powerful video on suicide, do you feel there
10:48needs to be, obviously you don't want more of that done because we didn't have to have that but
10:52do you feel as if something as powerful as that needs to be done more regularly to get that message home?
10:56Yeah 100% it has to be kind of ingrained in our season, it should be
11:06part of our kind of conversations throughout. I think it's always a real balance and we have
11:12to balance this, you don't want it to become so samey that people switch off from it either.
11:17The Norwich video was superb and to be able to see clubs throughout the country
11:23that have supported our Inside Out campaign and getting that conversation out in a way
11:29where it feels different, it feels comfortable and I think that video was a great example of that.
11:36So yes it has to be, but it has to be done in the right way and it has to be done
11:41with the right intentions. I would never want a club, anybody to feel like
11:48they're doing this because they have to, actually they're doing this with the intention of we know
11:52this can make a real difference. What's the next step of football when it comes to mental health in terms of
11:58probably more the education side, we're talking about generational going back to that, do you feel
12:02as if it is starting earlier in academy systems? I know if you care to share I've been in two academies
12:08and worked with under 21s, under 18s, under 17s and 16s as well, do you feel there's going to that
12:14younger generation? I mean the next steps for football, this topic is quite often
12:22used on the opposite side and I'm sure a lot of people disagree but seeing it from the inside,
12:28football is a hell of a lot ahead of normal environments, normal education environments.
12:34We are working with kids from the ages of seven, eight year old all the way through their journey
12:40up in the first team now and yes that's because they may have the financial investment to
12:47be able to do that but actually I think for me the next step and what could really be a huge learning
12:55is education, government, actually learning from the difference that it's making because
13:01what we've always talked about, we are seeing the change, we are seeing the change and we are seeing
13:07more people, more players engage with the support services that are accessible to them,
13:13reaching out, sharing the vulnerabilities. So actually for me the next step I believe for
13:18football is actually educating other services, other organisations on the differences it can
13:25make and you know obviously there's always more that football can do because of the
13:31competitive nature, because of the risk involved and actually the vulnerability
13:36of the players in terms of the likelihood of them making it but there's amazing people
13:43involved with football who aren't football people and are there for the players and I think
13:51it always kind of disappoints me because they always get tired with the same brush and
13:56they are doing so much, so much more than you know if I was an apprentice on one of the
14:04developments behind us, I certainly wouldn't be getting the access to the services that you would
14:09be as a professional athlete.