When we think of D-Day, perhaps the most vivid imagery comes not from the newsreels of the time, but from cinema — for example, the visceral, haunting battlefield scenes from “Saving Private Ryan.” Movie star, Tom Hanks, is a history buff and traveled to Normandy for the anniversary commemoration. Christiane spoke with him there about the meaning of this anniversary.
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00:00Hello, everyone, and welcome to Amanpour and Company.
00:07Here's what's coming up.
00:13Eighty years since D-Day, we reflect on the legacy of that turning point and on the brave
00:18young soldiers who saved the world, first with NATO's Supreme Allied Commander for Europe,
00:24General Christopher Cavoli, looking back on that day as war rages in Europe once again.
00:29Then...
00:30I don't think I was a hero.
00:32I was just like anybody else.
00:35We were all in this together.
00:38Personal recollections from a member of that greatest generation, 101-year-old D-Day veteran
00:44Jake Larson joined the program, and...
00:46If you've ever wondered what it was like, that's as close as somebody in Davenport,
00:51Iowa, or Oakland, California, or Minneapolis, Minnesota, was going to get to that.
00:55Capturing the past, actor and producer Tom Hanks tells me how cinema creates a crucial
01:01bridge between today and yesterday.
01:04Also ahead, where the Allies plan to turn the tide, my report from Churchill's war rooms.
01:10Plus, The Braves, how sculptor Annie-Laure Bannon immortalizes the heroes of Normandy
01:17in art.
01:36Common Porn Company is made possible by the Anderson Family Endowment, Jim Atwood and
01:42Leslie Williams, Candace King Weir, The Family Foundation of Layla and Mickey Strauss, Mark
01:50J. Bleschner, The Philemon M. D'Agostino Foundation, Seton J. Melvin, Charles Rosenblum, Ku and
01:59Patricia Ewan, committed to bridging cultural differences in our communities.
02:05Barbara Hope Zuckerberg, additional support provided by these funders, and by contributions
02:12to your PBS station from viewers like you.
02:16Thank you.
02:18Welcome to the program, everyone.
02:19I'm Christiane Awanpour in Normandy, France, where 80 years ago today on June 6, 1944,
02:26just after sunrise, Allied forces landed on Omaha Beach and several other beaches behind
02:33breaking through the Nazis' Atlantic wall.
02:36At huge cost, they turned the tide of World War II and began the liberation of Europe,
02:43a moment in time forever immortalized as D-Day.
02:46Americans, British, Canadians landed on a total of five beaches.
03:11Today, U.S. President Joe Biden and the French President Emmanuel Macron led the 80th anniversary
03:17commemorations and stood beside those world leaders, were the soldiers past and present,
03:24including members of that greatest generation who fought on the beaches here all those years
03:30ago.
03:31President Biden paid tribute to those heroes and, in a powerful speech, pointed to Russia's
03:37invasion of Ukraine, saying today's leaders must pick up the baton from veterans of the
03:42past by standing with Kiev.
03:46The Allied forces of D-Day did their duty.
03:50Now the question for us is, in our hour of trial, will we do ours?
03:56We're living in a time when democracy is more at risk across the world than at any point
04:00since the end of World War II, since these beaches were stormed in 1944.
04:08Now we have to ask ourselves, will we stand against tyranny, against evil, against crushing
04:13brutality of the iron fist?
04:17Will we stand for freedom?
04:18Will we defend democracy?
04:20Will we stand together?
04:22My answer is yes and only can be yes.
04:29And this commemoration comes at a painful moment for many, as war in Europe rages once
04:34again after Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
04:37And in an exclusive interview, I spoke about this echo with NATO's Supreme Allied Commander,
04:42General Christopher Cavoli.
04:44Here's our conversation.
04:47General Christopher Cavoli, welcome to the program.
04:49Thanks.
04:50Eighty years since D-Day.
04:52Did you ever imagine that you would be the top general in Europe at a time of such peril?
04:59Is it the worst peril we've been in for 80 years?
05:01Well, you know, it's not surprising to be in peril.
05:04The world brings us perils on occasion, and they happen throughout our careers, of course.
05:09I think the surprising thing is to have ended up in the top spot in Europe, yeah.
05:14How do you evaluate, though, what's happening?
05:16I mean, you're overseeing and basically fighting in certain ways the first raging war in Europe
05:22since World War II.
05:24So it's a very serious situation, obviously, right?
05:27We've seen large-scale aggression, state on state, return to the European continent.
05:34It hasn't been here for decades.
05:36For 80 years, it hasn't been here, really because of the NATO alliance.
05:41And so it's a very serious situation.
05:44On the other hand, the NATO alliance has sprung to the case and has stepped up to the plate
05:49and more unified than I've ever experienced it inside NATO, stronger, bigger, of course,
05:55with Finland and Sweden's accession.
05:57So it's a mixed bag.
05:59It's challenging times, but we have people and organizations that are designed and intended
06:05for those challenging times.
06:07Are you surprised by the amount of stress that NATO is getting?
06:11I mean, obviously, Ukraine is getting a lot of stress, and Ukrainians are dying, and Ukrainians
06:16are fighting.
06:17But you're trying to provide the weapons and as much help as you can.
06:20And yet we see that Europe has not been able to produce enough quantity to be able to give
06:26Ukraine what it needs, or even, they say, the defense secretaries, to actually defend
06:31Europe at the moment.
06:32Are you surprised by that shortfall?
06:35Well, if I can start with your first question, you know, am I surprised at the amount of
06:39stress NATO is getting?
06:41Not at all.
06:42NATO has been there the whole time.
06:43NATO has been waiting.
06:44But did you expect to be facing off against Russia?
06:45Well, no.
06:4680 years later?
06:47We didn't expect to do that.
06:48We thought we were going to be in a better place over the last 35 years.
06:51We hoped for the best.
06:52But the alliance has always been ready for this.
06:55And the alliance is returning to its roots of collective defense, territorial defense,
07:00very firmly planted on the eastern flank of NATO right now.
07:04We have forces in place, turned over to my command.
07:07We have air missions.
07:09We have ground troops.
07:10We have maritime groups constantly patrolling.
07:13We have more forces under SACEUR's command than we've had in decades.
07:18And we have brand new plans.
07:20And we are transforming the alliance for the purpose of collective defense.
07:25So there are something like 90,000 forces, right, that are undertaking exercises right
07:30now?
07:31Yeah, we just finished an exercise called Steadfast Defender, in which we practiced
07:35the large-scale reinforcement of the eastern flank.
07:38About 90,000 troops in total, yeah.
07:40And what should an adversary, the current one, take away from that?
07:45Are they staying, those 90,000?
07:47No, the troops that did the exercise and come back, and they'll return to their nations
07:52and they'll continue to prepare for future exercises and prepare for conflict if necessary.
07:57That's the way we deter.
07:59What do we practice during?
08:00What would the adversary see?
08:01The adversary would see a large military force that's under a cohesive, unified command that's
08:07able to move quickly across the continent to the point of need.
08:10And that's something they should take note of.
08:12Do you feel, like many do who I talk to, that Europe, the United States, should be
08:20preparing for a great power war?
08:22Well, the military should always be preparing for war.
08:25That's the way we keep the peace.
08:26It's more imminent than it's ever been.
08:28Well, I think, you know, serious times, as we said a minute ago.
08:32But the alliance is reacting exactly as the alliance should, by focusing on its readiness,
08:37by focusing on its plans, and being able to deter any conflict.
08:41I mean, you know, the question of great power conflict in Europe is a crucial one, and it's
08:46really our job, my job, to make sure it doesn't happen.
08:50And you've also, I mean, NATO also talks about China.
08:53I know it's sort of outside the theater of engagement, but it is on your radar, right?
08:58It is a NATO issue as well?
09:00Sure, sure.
09:01China's a global issue.
09:02Do you worry about that?
09:03China's a global issue.
09:04We do worry about China.
09:06We watch very closely where China makes their investments and where they try to gain influence
09:11inside the European theater.
09:13So we watch that very closely.
09:14All the allies keep a very close eye on that, sure.
09:17And do you think that the seven-month delay of American weapons to the front in Ukraine,
09:24well, do you think the Ukrainians can recover from that?
09:27Yes.
09:28How?
09:29They're recovering from it right now.
09:30First of all, we had things stacked up, ready to ship.
09:33So as soon as we got the authority to ship things into Ukraine, we began to do that again,
09:38within a couple of hours, literally.
09:41And so a vast quantity of stuff has been moved in in a very short amount of time.
09:45And it's making a difference on the battlefield, as you can see.
09:48In addition to that, the Ukrainians understood, they're keen observers of U.S. politics and
09:54Western politics in general.
09:56They understood what was going on, and they cleverly and strategically husbanded their
10:01resources and managed their operations accordingly.
10:05So it was a tough time for them, but I think they're going to be in a very good position
10:08as we come through this summer.
10:09They definitely lost a lot of people, and they had a lot of people wounded, and they
10:13have trouble with the conscription and with recruiting, unlike Russia, which doesn't have
10:19any trouble.
10:20And apparently no trouble producing weapons and ammunition either, because it's turned
10:23its entire economy onto a military footing.
10:26Do you think that — are you not concerned about Kharkiv and the Russians coming over
10:32and making such inroads in the east there and in the north?
10:36Sure.
10:37First, I have to point out, I do think the Russians have some challenges with recruiting,
10:40and they're coping with them.
10:42But there's a finite amount of access they have to their population of potential soldiers,
10:51and they've got some big decisions coming up about mobilization as well.
10:55So Kharkiv, sure, we're concerned about Kharkiv.
10:58We've helped the Ukrainians an awful lot to analyze the situation and to organize themselves
11:04in that area.
11:05When I talked to Oleg Sirsky, who's the commander of the Ukrainian military, he's confident
11:12that they'll hold and where they are, and they've got a good, strong defense.
11:16We've taken a good look at that defense, and we agree.
11:19So what is 2024 going to be for them, holding?
11:23I think 2024 is a force-generating year.
11:28Generate forces in Ukraine and be prepared for future operations.
11:34Both armies have been fighting quite a while, and both armies have suffered the bruises
11:40and the bumps that you get from fighting.
11:42And our Ukrainian colleagues and we are working together with all the countries, not just
11:48in the alliance, but throughout the contact group that Secretary Austin runs.
11:52We're working to generate force with them.
11:54And here we are, sitting here, so many fallen, so much remembrance, 80 years.
12:01What goes through your mind, your heart, when you see this and when you come here?
12:06Well, I think that these cemeteries at Normandy are some of the most touching things a soldier
12:12can visit.
12:14So I visited some of these cemeteries throughout the world.
12:17They're immaculately kept, right?
12:18I mean, we have retired officers and NCOs who devote their lives, their second careers
12:24to keeping these places like this.
12:26They're a source of great pride to me because America spends the time and effort to remember
12:31its own, even when they're buried on foreign soil.
12:34And the host nations, France, the French people, adore this place.
12:39They love it.
12:40They care for it as if it's their very own.
12:42And in many ways, it represents really the best of international cooperation and the
12:49relations between the United States and France in particular here.
12:52I could say the same thing about Belgium, the Netherlands, and on and on.
12:55So it's truly touching for me to visit here.
12:58Let me ask you, because I'm going to paraphrase what General Eisenhower said in his broadcast
13:03on June 6, 1944, you know, we are coming to liberate you and also to prepare for the liberation
13:09of all occupied territories.
13:12And there's certain polls and surveys that suggest that Europeans are not quite sure
13:18whether they can depend on America like they did 80 years ago, not just because of what
13:23we're seeing in Ukraine and the troubles and the stresses on the military, but also because
13:27of isolationist politics, because of an America first, but harking back, you know, I mean,
13:32Trump is merely a reincarnation of stuff that happened before the Second World War.
13:38Do you, how should people feel about America's commitment and ability and desire to keep
13:46defending them?
13:47You know, I think the fact that I'm sitting here in Eisenhower's seat, by the way, no
13:53pressure if you've got to follow somebody, try not to follow Dwight D.
13:57Eisenhower.
13:58Yeah.
13:59So the fact that the SACEUR, the Supreme Allied Commander for Europe is always an American
14:04is just one small representation of how committed we are to this, to this cause.
14:10The United States has always been here.
14:13It's always been a member of NATO.
14:15It always will be a member.
14:16And we're right here.
14:18We have thousands of soldiers that we deployed over here at the initiation of the war in
14:23Ukraine so that we could help our European allies to deter any further aggression.
14:29And as our allies have generated force, we've been able to pull some of those guys back.
14:33But the fact is, when the U.S. is needed, the U.S. is there.
14:37All right.
14:38General Cavoli, thank you very much indeed.
14:40Thank you so much.
14:41Appreciate it.
14:43Fighting words and a clear challenge ahead.
14:46As we've mentioned, it was 80 years ago today in 1944 that Allied forces stormed the beaches
14:52here in Normandy to liberate Europe.
14:55Now in 2024, veterans are returning to pay tribute to their fallen comrades and to ensure
15:01the world never forgets that sacrifice.
15:04As time marches on, the number of those from that greatest generation returning here grows
15:10fewer and fewer.
15:12But for those who are here, their voices ring louder than ever.
15:16Among them, D-Day veteran Jake Larson, who's taken his message to social media giant TikTok,
15:23amassing almost a million followers.
15:26I last spoke with Jake here at the 75th anniversary.
15:30That was 2019.
15:32And today, in the Normandy American Cemetery, we met again.
15:38Jake Larson, it's great to see you again.
15:40It was five years ago we first met here.
15:43And now how old are you?
15:46I'm going to be 102 in December.
15:51Wow.
15:52What is the secret of your health and longevity?
15:55I'll have to say, don't die.
16:01It's a good one.
16:02Don't die.
16:03You probably didn't know whether you would survive 80 years ago today, did you, when
16:08you landed on Omaha?
16:09God, no.
16:10I was afraid of those landmines they put in the beach there.
16:18We were getting small arms fire, but I was afraid I'd step on one of those mines.
16:26Germans had, I told you, at that time, it was a million mines.
16:33And when they started taking them out of there, they found one and a half million.
16:37Wow.
16:38You were one of the lucky ones.
16:40Do you remember what it was like when they just, I don't know, suddenly you find yourself
16:45getting out of one of those landing craft, you're on that beach, do you remember what
16:49it was like?
16:50Oh, do I?
16:51Like it was yesterday.
16:55I got on a landing craft and I had water right up to my chin.
17:01He let us out a little bit too far, but he was just a 17-year-old pilot for that boat.
17:10You were all kids.
17:12We were all kids, yes.
17:14And did you know then what you were fighting for?
17:17Oh, definitely.
17:19That we knew.
17:21Every one of us.
17:22Tell us.
17:24Every one of us was prepared to give our life to kick Hitler's ass out of Europe.
17:33And you did.
17:34And we did.
17:36We lost quite a few of us.
17:38I lost friends.
17:40Everybody lost friends.
17:42But we were soldiers.
17:46We were prepared to give our life.
17:49And now you, obviously a father, a grandfather, a great-grandfather, and your great-grandchildren
17:56and your grandchildren are making you into a social media star.
18:00You're on TikTok, Jake, since we last met.
18:03I don't know how that happened.
18:05How did it happen?
18:08It's crazy.
18:09When you go by Papa Jake, you have an actual name.
18:12Yes.
18:13And why do you do it?
18:18You know it's not me.
18:19It's my granddaughter.
18:20She says, oh, it's just a little storytelling thing, she says, and I put a couple of your
18:30stories on my TikTok.
18:34She came back within a week and says, Papa, I'm taking you off of my TikTok.
18:40I'm going to put you on your own.
18:42I said, you're opening a can of worms here.
18:45Why are you putting me on by myself?
18:49She says, because you showed me up on mine.
18:53It took me 10 months to get 10,000 viewers.
18:57You got that in a week.
19:00And how many do you have now?
19:02Well, the last time I looked, 800,000.
19:06It's just on the verge of a million.
19:09Yep, it is just on the verge of a million.
19:11And Jake, what stories are you telling?
19:14What do you want young people to know?
19:16I'm telling the stories of my life.
19:20And I'm a unique person.
19:28When I was 15 years old and my cousin Chick was 15 years old, he said, we didn't have
19:36any money.
19:39We're going to high school with no money.
19:43So he said, let's join the National Guard.
19:46I said, we got to be 15 or 18.
19:51He says, I said, we're just 15.
19:56He says, let's go to the Armory anyway and tell them we want to join.
20:02And we'll look them straight in the eye and say, when they say, how old are you?
20:07We'll say, 18, 18.
20:12So we went to the National Guard.
20:15And there was a huge captain sitting there.
20:19He looked up and said, what can I do for you young men?
20:25See?
20:26Wow.
20:27And I'm thinking, 18, 18.
20:30And he says, what year were you born?
20:34Wow.
20:35So I said, 19, 19, sir.
20:39Sign right here.
20:41That's the only thing he asked.
20:45We both got into the National Guard at 15.
20:49You wrote a book.
20:51And you told me that it's being used in high schools to teach kids.
20:56Yeah, grade schools, high schools.
20:59Yes.
21:00It's an honor.
21:02Does that make you feel proud?
21:04Proud?
21:05Proud?
21:08I have the University of Delaware.
21:17The history professor came from Delaware to California to interview me.
21:24He interviewed me for four hours.
21:28He used that book to train his future professors.
21:33And now that interview is in Eisenhower Library in Kansas.
21:39Today, it's 80 years since what you all did so heroically.
21:44I don't think I was a hero.
21:47I was just like anybody else.
21:50We were all in this together.
21:53I'm not a hero.
21:57People keep calling me hero.
22:00I changed that word.
22:02I took the O off of hero.
22:05I added T-O there.
22:08People say, well, what's a hereto?
22:11I says, I'm here to tell you that heroes are up there.
22:15They gave their life.
22:17They gave their life so that I could make it.
22:23My God, I got a wife.
22:26I got children.
22:27I got two boys and a girl.
22:29I got nine grandchildren.
22:31I got 11 great-grandchildren.
22:34I've got a grandson that's a grandfather.
22:37And I'm still going.
22:40Crazy.
22:41Will you come back again?
22:43Oh, God, yes, I'd come back again.
22:46Just to honor all those that gave their life so that I could be here.
22:53Jake Larson, thank you.
22:56Well, thank you, Cristiano.
23:07What a character, what a teacher.
23:10Today, leaders from across the world,
23:13including Ukraine's President Zelensky,
23:16turned out to pay tribute to veterans like Jake Larson.
23:19And at one point, Zelensky found himself the focus of thanks.
23:24Oh, no, no, no!
23:28I'm going to save you, the people!
23:33Bonded in a shared endeavor,
23:35flowers and wreaths have been laid at the Normandy memorials,
23:39and there have been some incredibly touching moments.
23:43There was a 21-gun salute for those who fell on that day,
23:47and this morning, when a lone piper landed on the beach,
23:51recreating the moment some 150,000 Allied troops
23:55arrived in France in 1944.
24:13And there were the bagpipes, of course.
24:15When we think of D-Day, perhaps the most vivid imagery
24:18comes not from the newsreels of the time, but from cinema.
24:22For example, the visceral, haunting scenes
24:25of Saving Private Ryan.
24:27That movie's star, Tom Hanks, is an amateur history buff.
24:30He calls himself a lay historian,
24:32and he takes it really seriously.
24:34And since that film, he's produced with Steven Spielberg
24:37the acclaimed TV series Band of Brothers, The Pacific,
24:40and most recently, Masters of the Air.
24:43He came to Normandy this time now to pay his respects
24:46to the veterans, and I spoke with him
24:48about why this anniversary means so much,
24:51and about the importance of storytelling and remembering.
24:55Tom Hanks, welcome.
24:57Christiane, how nice to see you.
24:59And here, this is almost your home as well.
25:02You've done so much on World War II.
25:04I just want to know what it feels like to be here on the 80th.
25:08It may be the last of these reunions.
25:10I don't... I mean, if you do the math,
25:13if you were... say you were 17 years old,
25:17and you were making your first trip into combat
25:20on June 6th of 1944.
25:23Do the math.
25:25You're now 97 years old.
25:27That they're here, I mean, the first thing I say
25:30to any of the veterans that I happen to meet is,
25:33don't get up, you know,
25:35because they're more or less wheelchair-bound.
25:37But there they are, resplendent in their patches and their hats
25:41and their caps and the memories.
25:44And I ponder what these last 80 years have been for them.
25:48I want to ask them,
25:50what's the most extraordinary thing you've witnessed
25:53since that day?
25:55And there's an awful lot to take note of.
25:58But would any of it have happened
26:00if this day had not been?
26:02Well, I wonder, you know,
26:04since you lead me straight into that question,
26:06it's probably, okay, bar the Cold War,
26:08when there wasn't a raging war in Europe,
26:10what would be the most difficult,
26:13most existential crisis for everybody
26:16since their sacrifice,
26:18with Russia having invaded Ukraine,
26:20with a literal raging war in Europe?
26:22I never thought there'd be a land war in Europe
26:25in my lifetime once again,
26:27because it had proven to be so disastrous
26:29for all of humanity the last time somebody tried that.
26:32And it's funny how often it comes out of the ego
26:35of one human being.
26:37One guy back in the 1930s says,
26:39no, I'm gonna solve all these problems
26:41because I know what works and what does not work.
26:44I think, you know, look, I'm a lay historian,
26:47and I'm as opinionated as any knothead
26:49that you're ever gonna come across.
26:51But there was this thought
26:53that America, particularly America,
26:55was lazy, was divided,
26:57was undisciplined,
26:59that couldn't get its act together,
27:01that would never band together
27:03in order just to do the right thing by choice.
27:06And when I'm here,
27:08I think of a bunch of kids.
27:10There was a young force that came here.
27:12They were somewhere between heights.
27:14If you were 25 years old, they called you Pops,
27:17or they called you the old man.
27:19And they, um, and they were,
27:21they left absolutely all of the comforts
27:23of a very comfortable America,
27:25safe America on the other side of the ocean.
27:27And they put themselves here for what?
27:29Um, because it was the right thing to do.
27:32And they were not defending a status quo.
27:35They were not gaining territory.
27:37They were not here for riches.
27:39They were not here to conquer anything.
27:41They were really here in order to,
27:43to, to mend the future,
27:45if I can coin a word that has just come out
27:47in a book that I read not too long ago.
27:49Um, there was an article,
27:51I want to say, in the Bedford newspaper,
27:53in which on, on the,
27:55on the 6th of June,
27:57because of the time lag,
27:59made it possible for the 6th of June
28:01to have this be the headlines,
28:04and it said the next 50 years of European history
28:06is being decided right now
28:08on the, on the fields and beaches of Normandy.
28:10It was not about everything
28:12that had happened prior to 1944.
28:14It was actually about what was going to happen
28:16in 1954 and 64.
28:18I was born in 1956.
28:20Had D-Day not happened,
28:22and that's not hard to imagine here,
28:24you can look around and we,
28:26we can see the evasion in our minds,
28:28we can see the day, but we can also imagine
28:30with a little bit of turn of frame,
28:32what would have happened if this had stayed
28:34as it had been, a conquered territory
28:36by one of the most murderous regimes.
28:38There we go.
28:40There's a FedEx that's delivering
28:42my, my, my, my Uber lunch right now.
28:44Um, what would it have been like
28:46if, um, all those,
28:48that young forces, and the Canadians,
28:50and the English, and all of the Free French
28:52had not come along and said,
28:54uh, those people are wrong.
28:56Can I ask you something?
28:58Because one man is doing it again,
29:00and he hasn't been invited.
29:02He was, uh, you know, ten years ago,
29:04but this time not.
29:06Do you think, when you think about it,
29:08Americans would do this again,
29:10British would do it again?
29:12I mean, we're in the fight of our lives again.
29:14Well, you don't have to go back
29:16very far to believe.
29:18As early as 1939 and 1940,
29:20and big parts of 1941,
29:22there was a huge vocal, uh,
29:24section of the United States of America
29:26that said, no way.
29:28There were, there were literally
29:30Nazi party rallies in Madison Square Garden,
29:32in which Adolf Hitler
29:34and George Washington's,
29:36their, their, their images
29:38were up on stage at the same time.
29:40It wasn't until, of course,
29:42that we were attacked that everybody
29:44kind of like wised up and realized
29:46that something very venal was going on in the world.
29:48You can't help but wonder
29:50where would we be right now,
29:52and I have absolute 100% faith in the American people
29:54and the concept of what is right and what is wrong,
29:56that something as definitive
29:58as what happened in Europe back then,
30:00I don't think there'd be any question,
30:02that it would take time.
30:04It would not be overnight.
30:06It would be, it would be thought out.
30:08It would be, I think, taking into account
30:10all the lessons that were learned
30:12of what happens when you don't do it right
30:14over the long course of time.
30:16Can I ask you, I, I walked over there,
30:18I looked at the beach, it's Omaha Beach,
30:20um, the, the cliffs that those boys had to scale,
30:22then they had to rush, you know,
30:24it was a place they didn't even know anything about
30:26and, as you say, they were so young.
30:28You did that film, Saving Private Ryan.
30:30I know you're an actor, but everybody says
30:32it's one of the most realistic depictions
30:34of what happened that day.
30:36Can you recall what it was like
30:38actually filming that and putting
30:40yourselves in their boots for that period of time?
30:42Well, of course, you know, part of it
30:44is glamorous fun, you know,
30:46but at the other time, as soon as the cameras
30:48started rolling and everything started happening,
30:50there was a tactile
30:52quality to the confusion.
30:54One of the things that happened was
30:56special effects guys would come up
30:58and all over the beach
31:00were these little red flags.
31:02They said, hey, be careful where the little red flags
31:04are because there's explosive charges
31:06underneath there and it's going to throw some stuff off.
31:08And whatever you do, don't step over there
31:10because that's a whole air ram that's going to
31:12throw a guy up in the air.
31:14And a guy down there is going to be lit on fire
31:16so try to stay away from him.
31:18And you put that together and it's just,
31:20but then it begins.
31:22And the first thing they did was
31:24remove all those red flags and I realized
31:26that now we are not in any
31:28danger at all whatsoever.
31:30But the barissimilitude, if I dare
31:32use that word,
31:34does put it in a different sort
31:36of form. There is a moment
31:38when, of course, as actors we're just
31:40pretending, but there comes a moment
31:42where the reason we're there is to capture the truth
31:44as the film
31:46rolls. And to be
31:48cold, wet, scared, and have
31:50it be awfully noisy for an awful long time.
31:52I remember
31:54when we were shooting, and by the way
31:56this is one of the reasons Steven Spielberg wanted to make
31:58the movie. He said, finally
32:00I'll be able to do with film technology
32:02I'll actually be able to capture what happened
32:04on Omaha Beach and here's how I'm going
32:06to do it. First, it's going to take three weeks.
32:08And secondly, it's going to be
32:10every single day. And third, we're going to
32:12have all kinds of stuff going off. And fourth,
32:14in between there, we'll make some sort of movie.
32:16At the same time, we're trying to load
32:18it up with as much
32:20authentic, and I wanted to use
32:22the word again, verisimilitude, as we can.
32:24That's our job as filmmakers.
32:26It's also our job as lay
32:28historians. Because for good or for bad,
32:30that movie is a document
32:32that has to accurately
32:34reflect the tenor of that
32:36day. And I'd like to think
32:38that we did. And hearing it from
32:40a number of people that said, as confusing
32:42as that is, well, multiply
32:44that by, we did not have the
32:46smell of cordite or
32:48burning flesh or, you know,
32:50blood on the sand. But
32:52we did have some version of
32:54that, whatever you can get out
32:56of a motion picture. I think we captured
32:58it. And to Stephen's credit,
33:00and I will also go along with
33:02the audience's credit as well,
33:04they were willing to suspend
33:06whatever disbelief of it and say,
33:08I've always, if you've ever wondered
33:10what it was like, that's as close
33:12as somebody in Davenport, Iowa
33:14or Oakland, California or
33:16Minneapolis, Minnesota was going to get.
33:18And then you went on with your
33:20production company to do
33:22so much more in the anthology of World War II,
33:24Band of Brothers, Pacific, and now
33:26the latest, Masters of the Air, about
33:28the Air Force.
33:30Why? What made you want to do that?
33:32And what do you want it to leave?
33:34I will tell you that
33:36all of the caregivers
33:38that I had, I mean, I was born
33:40in 56, so by the time I'm in
33:42kindergarten,
33:44everybody grown up to me is only 15
33:46years away from the war.
33:48And they divided their lives
33:50into three distinctive
33:52parts. They talked
33:54about being kids, and they would always say,
33:56well, you know, as a kid, we'd do this. Of course,
33:58that was before the war, they said.
34:00And then they said, oh, I went to college
34:02here and I got married here. Well, you have to
34:04understand, but that was after the war.
34:06They always said that. And when
34:08they talked about those years of
34:10stasis, if I'm using the word correctly,
34:12and really between 1939,
34:14certainly between 1941
34:16to mid
34:18to late 1945,
34:20they are talking about
34:22almost like a Martian time slip.
34:24This period of time existed
34:26where nobody had
34:28any idea of what was going
34:30to happen in another week and a half.
34:32Who was going to die? Who was going
34:34to come back? Were they going
34:36to be invaded? And that long
34:38period of time, I think
34:40it was,
34:42if it wasn't a bona fide scar,
34:44it was
34:46a saga in their lives that
34:48they felt as though that they were lucky
34:50to have survived
34:52those three years.
34:54As soon as
34:56you take up any sort of thematic
34:58motion picture telling,
35:00you end up learning so
35:02much that you cannot squeeze
35:04into a two and a half hour motion picture.
35:06It does take another
35:08eight hours here, or another ten hours
35:10there. Not in order to get the grand
35:12overview of it, but the specific
35:14tiny details that make
35:16every episode
35:18human. Never mind history.
35:20Never mind authentic. It becomes
35:22human. Because there are guys
35:24that got to get up and brush their teeth.
35:26There's guys that got to get up and be cold.
35:28There's guys that got to bury their best
35:30friends for no reasons
35:32It's our job
35:34as I think artists in order to
35:36make that act as
35:38recognizable as
35:40not mythic behavior, not historic
35:42behavior, but it's human behavior
35:44that each one of us can go for.
35:46Do you think it'll get more difficult
35:48now that the vets
35:50are reaching
35:52the end of their lives
35:54to pass the stories along?
35:56I would like to think that there's anything me and my
35:58not-head friends have done down at the office
36:00has brought great currency
36:02to the stories that those men tell.
36:04You know, you could have been
36:06a veteran of this great, great
36:08struggle and you could have died
36:10in a car crash or of a stroke
36:12in 1958
36:14and you were just as big and huge
36:16a hero and a contributor to freedom
36:18and liberty and everything like that as any of
36:20these guys here. If you're 17
36:22years old and it's your first
36:24mission in combat is to jump out
36:26of a plane or come ashore on Omaha
36:28in 1944,
36:30you are now 97. If you've
36:32made it to 97, come
36:34forward. Tell us everything. Let us
36:36know whatever it is. And these guys, old guys
36:38now, they're TikTok stars.
36:40They have young people. They said, tell us more
36:42about it. And everything that comes out of
36:44them, I think, is a precious
36:46bit of scripture that should be read and studied.
36:48On this day, President Biden
36:50is also obviously giving his big
36:52speeches and it'll all be
36:54in the cloak of democracy.
36:56That's what we're defending.
36:58And
37:00without mentioning
37:02Donald Trump, he
37:04will talk about the stakes for America
37:06and for the world. Finally,
37:08do you worry about
37:10the United States in terms
37:12of its commitment to democracy and freedom
37:14and everything these people died for
37:16if there's another Trump presidency?
37:18I think there's always a reason to be worried
37:20about the short term, but I look at the longer
37:22term of what happened. I think
37:24there's an ongoing
37:26look. Our
37:28Constitution says, we the people
37:30of the United States, in order to form a
37:32more perfect union,
37:34that journey to a more perfect
37:36union has missteps in it. We
37:38know. I can catalogue them as much
37:40as you can. And you're a professional journalist
37:42and I'm just a guy that makes movies and reads books.
37:44And a historian. Okay, and a
37:46lay historian, I'll take that too. Over the
37:48long term, however, we
37:50inevitably make progress towards
37:52I think that more perfect
37:54union. And
37:56how does it come about? It comes
37:58about because, not because of somebody's
38:00narrative of who is right or who
38:02is a victim or not. It comes out of the
38:04slow melding of the truth
38:06to the actual practical life
38:08that we end up living. It comes down to
38:10the good deed that is
38:12practiced with your neighbour,
38:14with your local merchants. And I will
38:16always have faith that the United States
38:18of America and the Western
38:20societies that have adopted more or less
38:22the same sort of democracy
38:24cannot help but turn towards
38:26what is right.
38:28And they told us how?
38:30They were
38:32kids
38:34by and large.
38:36They were well practiced.
38:38Some of them, you know, years ago,
38:40actually on the 65th, which is the last time
38:42we were here, I happened to have
38:44dinner with the great Andy Rooney,
38:46who himself was a veteran.
38:48And he said,
38:50Oh come on, they're not all heroes.
38:52Some of them were in the 38th shoe repair
38:54battalion. And yet,
38:56even if you were in a shoe repair battalion,
38:58there were guys, if you read
39:00Ambrose, there were guys whose
39:02job it was, they came to Europe
39:04to do one thing and one thing only.
39:06To take busted weapons and make
39:08them workable again. To take exploded
39:10Jeeps, cobble together a bunch of parts
39:12in order to get them moving again.
39:14Those guys lost as much sleep
39:16and had as bad of teeth from the horrible
39:18food that they ate and were as
39:20exhausted as anybody else was because
39:22they woke up every morning and said, What do I have to
39:24do in order to further up this
39:26cause of liberation?
39:28I'm not going to discount anybody for
39:30what they went through at that time, even if
39:32all they did was type out very, very important
39:34papers on the
39:36typewriters somewhere well
39:38behind the lines. I go back again
39:40to that concept.
39:42It was the great
39:45communal effort.
39:47Periodically, in the United States
39:49of America, great communal
39:51efforts come to be.
39:53They end up changing the world for the
39:55people who take part in it
39:57and actually want to end up, I can't
39:59say it enough, probably like a
40:01little goody two-shoes, but
40:03they do the right thing. They wake up every
40:05morning and they think, What do I need to do today
40:07in order to create that
40:09more perfect union that always seems
40:11to be just slightly out of
40:13our grasp, but on the cusp of reality,
40:15I like to think. Tom Hanks, thank you so much.
40:17Pleasure to talk to you. What a day.
40:19What a day.
40:21A great communal
40:23effort indeed, and now we turn
40:25to one of the most consequential sites
40:27of World War II, and that was
40:29about the preparation, Winston Churchill's
40:31Cabinet War Rooms. This
40:33underground bunker was
40:35the nerve center of Britain's war
40:37effort, where operations like
40:39the Normandy invasion were planned
40:41as bombs rained down on
40:43London overhead.
40:45Seventy years after D-Day, back
40:47in 2014, I toured
40:49the war rooms with historian and
40:51broadcaster Taylor Downing.
40:53So we're in the
40:55Cabinet Room itself
40:57in the Churchill War Rooms, which were
40:59built just before the Second World War,
41:01intended to be
41:03a sort of underground bunker, really.
41:05And still so atmospheric. I mean, look.
41:07Oh, yeah. Churchill's cigar.
41:09Was that really his? I don't know, but the cigar is
41:11there, the dispatch box.
41:13And this was his chair? This was the chair.
41:15It's as though the Cabinet have just left.
41:17They've just walked out the door. They've sort of
41:19kept the place with this very, very atmospheric
41:21feel. Its location
41:23was, of course, top secret at the time.
41:25It was built to withstand
41:27bombing so that
41:29the whole of government could carry on.
41:31Down here, there were all the
41:33key offices that were needed,
41:35the military headquarters, the map room.
41:37There was accommodation for senior
41:39staff. Churchill had his own bedroom down here.
41:41Taylor, this obviously hasn't
41:43changed much since those days.
41:45It's still dark.
41:47It's very atmospheric, I think. And what you've got to
41:49imagine is that this is below
41:51ground. Nobody down here knows what's
41:53happening up above. They had a big
41:55ventilation plant that they brought in to
41:57try and pump air around. But it would have been
41:59very stuffy, very hot,
42:01and everybody puffing away. When the Prime Minister
42:03himself is a great cigar smoker,
42:05he's not going to stop smoking.
42:07So you can't tell anybody else. They can't smoke.
42:09So we're coming here into the map
42:11room, which was really the heart
42:13of the operation of this underground
42:15war rooms, this underground bunker.
42:17This is a reconstruction as it would have been at the
42:19end of the war. Somebody from the RAF, somebody
42:21from the army. You look a bit surprised to see us.
42:23It's incredibly lifelike.
42:25It is. It's as though we've interrupted
42:27a rather important meeting. And there were
42:29unbelievably important meetings here.
42:31This is where Churchill,
42:33although he was a great wordsmith
42:35and we remember him for the great words
42:37and the phrases and the inspiration
42:39to the people of Britain
42:41and the whole free world at the time.
42:43He actually had a very visual way of
42:45understanding things. He liked maps. He liked
42:47charts. He liked anything that gave him a
42:49visual display of what
42:51was going on. A version of the
42:53map room was packed up
42:55and taken with him
42:57so that wherever he was, he could have this
42:59update of what was going on.
43:01Churchill wanted to be in Normandy
43:03on D-Day. He did. He was actually in this
43:05very room on the 1st of June
43:07getting a briefing
43:09with the King.
43:11The King came down here? The King was down here
43:13on this day as well, George VI.
43:15And they were having a briefing about what was
43:17going to happen on D-Day. And Churchill
43:19says, you know, I really want to
43:21be there on D-Day myself.
43:23You can imagine the sort of, my God
43:25the Prime Minister wants to be in the
43:27front line of a huge
43:29operation like D-Day. And so he asked
43:31if he could go on HMS Belfast, which
43:33was the flagship of the Royal Naval Commander
43:35to watch the landings
43:37happen. Now, he's the Prime Minister.
43:39No other politician
43:41can overrule him.
43:43He's the commander of the
43:45forces, so the military can't say
43:47we don't want you here, sir.
43:49And what happens in the end is that the King
43:51a day afterwards writes to him and says
43:53Winston, I don't think it's a good idea
43:55for you to go to D-Day.
43:57What happens if the ship hits a mine
43:59or is shelled
44:01by the Germans and sinks?
44:03The last thing we want to do at a
44:05critical moment in the war is to lose
44:07our Prime Minister. So effectively
44:09what happens is that reluctantly
44:11Churchill stands down and the King
44:13for the first time tells his Prime Minister
44:15you can't do something.
44:17Which is an interesting constitutional
44:19turnaround. It's a very rare turnaround, isn't it?
44:21This is a really rare
44:23permission to come into this room. I don't think
44:25anybody gets to see this inside
44:27and here we are with Churchill
44:29on the phone. He's on the phone to Roosevelt.
44:31This is the room in which
44:33he had the top secret direct
44:35line to the White House.
44:37In fact, the outside
44:39had a door just like a private
44:41loo at WC.
44:43Even his staff
44:45thought he was going to the loo. He would come
44:47in here, get on the phone to Roosevelt
44:49and then emerge afterwards. So it was so secret
44:51this hotline.
44:53Even people in this secret bunker
44:55didn't know that this was where the Prime Minister
44:57and the President spoke.
44:59And it was where he
45:01helped build up the relationship
45:03and bond
45:05and talk with the President
45:07and it was a really important
45:09tiny but really important space.
45:11The country was in a sense very
45:13lucky in 1940
45:15when Churchill was appointed Prime Minister
45:17through those dark days of 1940
45:19France
45:21the Blitz
45:23when Britain really was back up
45:25against the wall. To have a man who not only
45:27understood military things
45:29but gave a huge encouragement
45:31to new ideas, new technologies
45:33he really galvanized
45:35Britain's fairly feeble
45:37at times military efforts.
45:39He was the right leader in the right place
45:41at the right time and we're very lucky for that
45:43today. What would have happened if it
45:45hadn't been him?
45:47Difficult to see that we would have
45:49fought on.
45:51Probably what would have happened was some sort of truce
45:53with Hitler in the summer of 1940
45:55and history would have been very very
45:57different.
45:59The veterans, how many
46:01do you think survive today?
46:03Well it's said that in
46:051994 for the 50th anniversary
46:07there were 20,000
46:09veterans on the Normandy beaches
46:11who went there to
46:13be part of that 50th
46:15anniversary. But you know I think
46:17they're the real heroes. I mean here we've been
46:19looking at where the strategic planning
46:21took place, where the thinking through
46:23obviously there was Eisenhower's headquarters
46:25down on the south coast where the
46:27specific military planning took place
46:29as well. But in the end
46:31a great operation like this
46:33is down to the men who come out of the
46:35landing craft first
46:37who jump from aircraft. They're the real
46:39heroes of D-Day.
46:41Did they think they were? No.
46:43Not at all. I've met lots
46:45of these guys and they are the
46:47humblest people. What they tell you
46:49is that it was a
46:51job that had to be done.
46:53They had to do it.
46:55And for instance Captain Dick
46:57Winters, the
46:59famous man who was at the centre of the band of
47:01Brothers, Damien Lewis, plays him
47:03in the Steven Spielberg
47:05miniseries of the name. You ask him
47:07were you a hero? And he says no.
47:09He says but I served with a
47:11company of heroes.
47:13And that's very typical of the spirit of that
47:15generation. There's no sort of me, me, me
47:17about it. It was a job that had to be done
47:19and we went out there and we did it.
47:21And you have to admire that
47:23humility and that spirit.
47:25You do indeed.
47:27And indeed from Jake Larson, our
47:29101 year old veteran, we heard
47:31that same humility and shared
47:33endeavour. Now throughout this
47:35hour we have heard all
47:37about the heroic bravery of veterans
47:3980 years ago on Omaha
47:41Beach. That sheer courage is being honoured
47:43by an impossible to miss
47:45stainless steel sculpture.
47:47It's called Les Braves. It was unveiled
47:49on the 60th D-Day anniversary
47:51in 2004 and it has
47:53since stood among crashing waves
47:55becoming a permanent part
47:57of the memorial. And
47:59earlier the international ceremony took
48:01place in front of the giant structure.
48:03Its sculptor is Annie-Laure
48:05Bannon and she's here with me now.
48:07It is nice to see you again.
48:09Welcome. You've just come from the
48:11international ceremony.
48:13What did it feel like? We talked
48:15when you first unveiled it.
48:17It's amazing to have been here exactly 20 years ago.
48:19Crazy.
48:21Wonderful. It was
48:23so much emotion to see
48:25the same veterans.
48:27They were not many
48:29but they were really being honoured
48:31with a medal and so
48:33they were standing up.
48:35It was really fantastic to see how
48:37bearing the weight of
48:39all the people, all their friends
48:41that died there. You had this feeling
48:43that they
48:45were very humble because they thought
48:47about, I don't know if you know
48:49what I mean. You really feel that
48:51that's what they were thinking about their friends.
48:53So you talk about the humility
48:55and what they were thinking. What were you
48:57thinking when you created Les Braves
48:59because it's very
49:01expansive. It's not a humble piece.
49:03No, because you cannot make
49:05the brave small. Their courage
49:07was huge and so for me it was
49:09impossible to do
49:11something small about their bravery.
49:13It has to be a minimum
49:15to look up to.
49:17You had to raise your eyes and look
49:19up to what they did. So we're seeing the pictures
49:21on the screen as we talk.
49:23Just describe
49:25the modules. You've got three distinct
49:27parts of that.
49:29In fact, I did three pieces because
49:31I thought that this bravery,
49:33this courage and what they did
49:35was a common action.
49:37So at the
49:39center it writes freedom.
49:41It's because I thought that I really
49:43wanted to show that their sacrifice
49:45was eternal.
49:47It was about life, not about death.
49:49So they are rising up
49:51from the sand and they have this
49:53big column that are the only
49:55straight column
49:57or structure in this culture.
49:59The two straight towers
50:01and those are honor and freedom
50:03that they brought us back and they are surrounded
50:05by those wings of hope and fraternity
50:07because it was all together.
50:09The freedom came
50:11from the sea.
50:13It's wings and it's sails.
50:15It has all this symbolism.
50:17How did it come that you've just
50:19opened or I think it's about to open
50:21or it has opened
50:23a sister sculpture in Michigan?
50:25Yes, absolutely.
50:27Timing is a synchronicity
50:29because when I started Libhav here
50:3120 years ago, I always wanted
50:33to do a connection because all my
50:35work is about connecting people
50:37so that together we are much stronger
50:39and nothing is impossible.
50:41I really wanted to do a second one but
50:43it took three years and a lot of
50:45efforts to do this one so I thought
50:47something will happen and the right place
50:49will come and it came
50:51when the war memorial
50:53in Rose Point, Michigan called me and it says
50:55we walked on that beach and
50:57how could it be possible to have a
50:59twin sculpture and I said that's exactly
51:01what I wanted 20 years ago so
51:03we did and it was wonderful
51:05to work with them.
51:07Where is it located exactly?
51:09It's Rose Point, Michigan.
51:11It's just on Lake Michigan
51:13so it's the frontier with Canada
51:15so it's another symbol
51:17of all these people that came to help us
51:19and it really
51:21was a beautiful inauguration.
51:23What does it mean to you as a French
51:26woman to do this sculpture
51:28given that Les Braves
51:30liberated your country and
51:32liberated the rest of Europe?
51:34It's like if you can say
51:36thank you in so many ways
51:38that's my way because I'm an artist
51:40and it's also not only a way
51:42to thank them, it's a way to show to the
51:44young generation I really wanted to show
51:46that bravery and courage
51:48is not an old fashioned
51:50value, it's something
51:52that certainly today and with all the
51:54182 and more
51:56wars around the world
51:58right now, you know bravery
52:00is something that's something we have to
52:02You know you've just touched on that
52:04the tragedy is that this
52:06anniversary and the dwindling
52:08number of veterans, Les Braves
52:10is coming
52:12right at a time when there is
52:14another war in Europe
52:16and obviously what's happening in Israel and
52:18Gaza. Yeah, it is
52:20striking that
52:22we don't learn
52:24and I'm thinking you know that women
52:26are the first
52:28victims with children of all
52:30those wars because you know they always
52:32even they are
52:34victims as women also
52:36so what about if all the new diplomacy
52:38you know they get involved a little bit
52:40don't you think so? I think so
52:42start a trend, more women around the peace table
52:44Annie Lau, Bannon
52:46more women on the art front
52:48and it's wonderful and you didn't think
52:50it would last more than 6-7 months
52:52but it lasted 28
52:54people wanted to
52:56the sculpture to stay
52:58when people want something
53:00thank you very much for being with us
53:02on this 80th anniversary
53:04and finally tonight
53:06they lived happily ever after
53:08among the many veterans honoured
53:10today was the 100 year old
53:12Harold Terence
53:14who was on D-Day and stationed in
53:16Britain preparing and repairing
53:18damaged planes which were returning from France
53:20but Harold is in France
53:22not only to commemorate D-Day
53:24he's got bigger plans
53:26to marry his girlfriend of 3 years
53:2896 year old
53:30Jeanne Swerlin, take a listen
53:34it's so peaceful
53:36I would like to see the whole world
53:38at peace and I hope that
53:40our love story
53:42will reflect
53:44on a lot of people
53:46in the world
53:48that are suffering today
53:50like Ukraine and Gaza
53:52and they certainly look happy
53:54Terence and Swerlin will tie the knot
53:56this weekend in a town just near
53:58the beaches where he and the other
54:00US troops landed 80 years ago
54:02today, it is never too late
54:04for love, that's it for now
54:06but make sure to tune in tomorrow
54:08for my exclusive interview
54:10with General CQ Brown Junior
54:12he's chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
54:14and the highest ranking American
54:16military officer
54:18and heir to such giants as the World War II
54:20General Omar Bradley
54:22who was first to hold the job
54:24I asked General Brown if America today
54:26could meet a challenge on the scale
54:28of the Normandy invasion
54:30our freedom is not free
54:32and democracy
54:34can stand on its own
54:36but we've got to make sure we're prepared
54:38and one of the things I focus on is ensuring
54:40that we have the war fighting skill
54:42and it's been said that
54:44Americans of this generation have not
54:46yet internalized what apparently a lot of
54:48military, certainly NATO military
54:50believe that it's not inconceivable
54:52that there could be a great power
54:54war again and that you have to prepare
54:56for it. Do you think people
54:58at home
55:00even in Europe understand
55:02how difficult a situation
55:04we're living through right now?
55:06Well I'll tell you, I have a sense it's coming
55:08along and having worked
55:10in the Indo-Pacific before
55:12here in Europe and in the
55:14Middle East, I've watched over the years
55:16and particularly over the past few years
55:18how the war has not only
55:20for those of us in uniform but with our
55:22elected leadership and the American public
55:24and we've got to continue to remind folks
55:26that when you look at the situation
55:28that we're seeing that we
55:30just can't watch, we've got to be
55:32we've got to lead. Be vigilant and
55:34lead and much more of that interview
55:36of course tomorrow. Thank you for watching
55:38and goodbye from Normandy
55:40and we'll leave you now with some more
55:42poignant images from this historic day