We chat with Lord of the Rings star Viggo Mortensen about directing, composing, and starring in his latest film, The Dead Don't Hurt.We discuss what makes the perfect Western, what he learnt from working with heavyweight directors, and whether he’d return as Aragorn in a Lord of the Rings reboot.We also discuss Mortensen’s favourites from his back catalogue, and role that got away that almost changed his career.
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00:00I could play a princess if I wanted to.
00:02You could play a princess now, I think people would warm to that.
00:06Hello Vigo, it's great to see you.
00:08You're a Jack of all trades, well Vigo of all trades.
00:10Director, writer, actor, composer.
00:12What was the thing that made you go,
00:14yeah this is the project I want to write, this is the project I want to see through?
00:18Well I like the story.
00:21I started out writing a story about an independent, strong-willed woman and
00:25I placed her on the North American frontier in the middle of the 19th century because I thought
00:33it would be more challenging for her to be in a place, a society that's more or less lawless
00:42and dominated by a few powerful unscrupulous men who are not
00:49averse to using violence to achieve their goals, you know.
00:54I thought that would create more obstacles for her and I like westerns.
00:58Once I realized that, I thought okay, so we're gonna make a western.
01:00Let's make the most of it in terms of all the research, making sure that
01:06the look of things, the clothing, the places we see and the language we hear,
01:11that it's all historically correct, the weapons, everything.
01:15And also a certain diversity that you don't always see in westerns, you know,
01:22racially, ethnically, linguistically.
01:25But we wanted to make a classic western, you know,
01:27that it looked and felt like those movies I grew up watching.
01:32So you don't think so much of how the camera's seeing the things,
01:34you just see these landscapes and you see the people in them and
01:38and almost feel like what it would have been like to be there, you know.
01:46Just like as a kid when I would watch those movies, I'd ask myself,
01:48would I be as brave as, let's say, Vivienne in this case?
01:52Would I commit errors like Olsen does?
01:54Would I admit to them?
01:57I don't know.
01:57Would I be a coward?
01:59What would happen?
02:00But knowing that there were some things that were different,
02:03that you stay with her always.
02:04I love that.
02:05Even when he goes off to war, you know.
02:07That's unusual.
02:08For me, that is what stood out.
02:09How, you know, you'd usually follow Holger to the civil war,
02:12but we stayed with Vivienne and we saw her story and waited with her.
02:16That's really stood out to me.
02:18I'm a sense being all alone on a night like this.
02:20No different than any other.
02:22I am fine, Mr. Jeffries.
02:24No, you most certainly are.
02:26It's four, which I was listening to and thinking,
02:29this is great, I need to see who did this when the credits rolled.
02:32And I see your name.
02:33So I'm intrigued to just know the process of
02:36when you decided that you were going to score this.
02:38If you kind of borrowed from stuff you'd already composed.
02:41Yeah, in this case, no, I didn't.
02:42It was all new for this movie.
02:46I mean, I've written some other scripts,
02:47which I hope to be able to direct someday.
02:50If I can find the money.
02:52Somebody's willing to take a chance on it.
02:54But in this case, I had a clear idea of what I wanted it to sound like
02:57and had some ideas of how to achieve it.
03:00And I was lucky to work with Cameron Stone,
03:02great cellist, and Scarlett Rivera, amazing violinist.
03:07And my friend, Travis Dickerson,
03:08with whom I've recorded lots of music over the years.
03:11And we recorded all this in his studio well before the shoot.
03:17Many, many months before.
03:19And that was part of the writing process, really,
03:21in the sense that I had the script and I sat down at the piano
03:25and I started working out melodies, themes,
03:29deciding what scenes, what sequences would need them.
03:33And it worked out well,
03:35because I was able to present that, play it for people on the team.
03:41It's a great score.
03:42And I'm intrigued to just hear about you as a director,
03:45who you've drawn upon,
03:46whether you've had experience with the directors.
03:49I know some thanks to Agnes Varda and Peter Bogdanovich,
03:53and of course, Peter Jackson.
03:55And just, yeah, if you could speak to me to some of your inspirations
03:58and why those directors are in your thanks.
04:01The best of them, if you're open to taking on board
04:05what other people think about what's happening in the moment.
04:09It's not a threat to me.
04:11It just means you're involved.
04:13I think any shoot, bonds are formed, sometimes in terrible shoots, you know.
04:19Yeah, because of talent.
04:21In a different way, yeah, because of, you know, the adversity.
04:25It tends to be little groups that don't connect with each other.
04:28But when it's everybody pulling in the same direction,
04:32then it's a more universal, positive feeling, you know, that you have.
04:38And you make a better movie, I think.
04:40It's more effective.
04:41I mean, there are people who direct in a more, let's say,
04:46authoritarian way in which they're inflexible.
04:50And maybe they even feel threatened by someone making a suggestion.
04:54I'm in charge and I want everybody to understand
04:57that all the ideas are mine, all the good ideas.
05:02That's really just insecurity, I think.
05:04I think if you're just, you realize, you know,
05:06there's no threat to your authority.
05:07They're just trying to improve what you're doing.
05:09It's a team sport, really.
05:12You've mentioned in the past few weeks how you carried Aragon's sword
05:15and you asked Peter Jackson for, you know, if you could do that for permission.
05:20But did you carry anything that we couldn't see
05:22from your experiences of working with Peter Jackson over the years?
05:24Anything that you've kind of...
05:25Well, no, just his problem-solving skills,
05:28his way of working with his team,
05:32much larger team than our movie, obviously, on Lord of the Rings.
05:36So just in line of like a film from your back catalogue
05:39that you think deserve more love, do you have one in mind?
05:42Like to have been seen more?
05:44Yeah.
05:46I would say Far From Men,
05:50which in French was called Loin des Hommes.
05:52And it's really well made.
05:54It's directed by David O'Horfin, a writer-director, a French one.
05:58And he's really talented.
06:00It takes place in Algeria at like 1954,
06:05at the start of the war for independence there.
06:09And we're eventually, by 1962, the Algerians kicked the French out.
06:15Long, horrible war.
06:18And I play a schoolteacher up in the mountains.
06:25And I'm from the same area that Reda's character is.
06:29He's an Arab farmer.
06:32And I'm teaching French in the old sort of school system there.
06:36At the outbreak of the war, things become untenable for me.
06:39And it's a story about these two men.
06:42Beautiful, beautiful movie.
06:44With a great soundtrack by Nick Cave and Warren Ellis.
06:50Landscapes are incredible.
06:51Photography is really, really beautiful.
06:53It's a very satisfying, very emotional story.
07:02It won a bunch of awards at Venice, I think.
07:04And then, I guess, the distribution didn't fall in place.
07:07Right, yeah.
07:07And we had a great...
07:08It was in competition at the Venice Film Festival, that's true.
07:12We had a long, long standing ovation.
07:14It was really, really exciting.
07:15So it was disappointing when movies don't...
07:18I mean, maybe it'll achieve a certain cult status.
07:22I think it's wonderful.
07:24I couldn't help but, when I watched it, there were parallels.
07:27I mean, there are parallels to what was happening in the world then.
07:30But, you know, humanitarian crisis, oppressive forces,
07:33forcing people out of where they live.
07:35It's very timely, you know.
07:37That's true.
07:38That's true.
07:39And that sort of mistrust of the other.
07:42But we made it at the end of 2012, I think is when we were shooting.
07:46But it was like just the war in Iraq and since 9-11.
07:52The mistrust of the Muslim world, of Arabs, a certain racial profiling.
07:59Just the mistrust between different peoples.
08:02It's a complex story and deals with that in a very honest and moving way, I think.
08:10You play roles like that very well.
08:12I mean, you play other roles also that aren't, you know, as heroic.
08:18But do you find yourself...
08:20Do you view yourself as a good heroic actor?
08:23Is that how you kind of...
08:24I haven't thought about it.
08:25I mean, I think I'm a conscientious actor in the sense that
08:31I realize that if I'm going to play a role, then I make the most of it.
08:37What happened before page one.
08:39Really build up who this person is to make them as real as you can.
08:45Give them as many layers.
08:48In other words, as much humanity as possible.
08:51And don't shy away from the sort of uncomfortable things that maybe characters do sometimes.
08:56You just have to be honest about it.
08:58But I don't think of myself as a type of actor.
09:01I just think I'm an actor.
09:04Obviously, Lord of the Rings is back in...
09:08I mean, it's never really out of the spotlight, but it's back in the spotlight.
09:11What with the new Gollum franchise being launched by Andy Serkis and Peter Jackson.
09:16In that film, I think there's a lot of speculation about when that's going to be set.
09:19And there's a lot of theories that maybe it will feature a younger version of Aragorn
09:23as it's set back in a day.
09:24Do you have any advice if that ever did come about and someone else was cast in the role?
09:29Firstly, who do you think would make a good younger Aragorn?
09:32And secondly, what advice would you give?
09:35I have no idea who would make a good one.
09:38I mean, it wouldn't be different than any other role.
09:41Know your lines and show up on time.
09:44It's the most important.
09:44Be a nice person.
09:47You know, enjoy what you're doing if you can.
09:50Remember, it is play.
09:51It is make-believe.
09:52And it's serious.
09:54You have a schedule and you're supposed to, as I say, know your lines and put in your
10:00day's work.
10:01But remember to play.
10:03Remember to enjoy it if you can.
10:05Enjoy the experience.
10:06Because it's in playfulness that inventiveness happens, you know, that surprises happen.
10:11And that you're open to surprises that come to you from others rather than resistant or
10:17just locked into a certain tunnel vision in terms of what you want to do.
10:22Enjoy it.
10:23And would you, if there was ever, I know they're mooting like a few future franchises based
10:27in the Lord of the Rings world, would you return as Aragorn in some form and lead your
10:32own franchise if asked?
10:34If it seemed right and it was faithful to what Tolkien wrote, sure, why not?
10:39I mean, I had a good experience learning about that world.
10:42It was really fun.
10:44And lastly, I just want to ask you about, just out of my interest, Chronos of the Future,
10:49a film which I've revisited a few times because it's just my view and it changes every time
10:54I watch it, like how I sit with it.
10:55But your performance in that film is quite something.
10:58Is it a thrill seeing that on screen or are there moments where you're like, whoa, I
11:02wish I did it a bit different?
11:03Like, as an actor, what's the experience?
11:05There's always something that you could have done better.
11:07Sometimes it's out of your hands, you know, if you're not editing the movie, directing
11:11it.
11:12They might choose a take or an angle or line reading that's, you wonder why, but it fits
11:18into their idea of how the story should be put together and that's all there is to it.
11:22You know, when you're an actor, you're giving them a certain hue of a certain color
11:27and then they use that to complete the painting, you know, and that's it.
11:30You walk away.
11:31I mean, some actors, and I understand this, they're unwilling to watch themselves in
11:37anything they do because it just freaks them out.
11:39All you can see is what you did wrong or what you didn't, the opportunities you missed
11:44along the way.
11:45And I can see those things, but I can live with them and use them as a learning experience
11:52for the next time, you know, and every character is different.
11:57I like challenges.
11:58I mean, I think when we're kids, we don't really think about it much, you know.
12:02I remember fantasizing that I was an explorer or that I was, you know, I don't know, Stanley
12:07Livingston or a cowboy or even a Lakota warrior.
12:11You know, you don't limit yourself as a kid.
12:13There isn't a, you know, political correctness police in your head.
12:19As a child, you're free and you do anything you want.
12:22I could play a princess if I wanted to, you know.
12:25And you could play a princess now.
12:26I think people would try.
12:28People would warm to that.
12:29Were there any kind of roles back in the 90s, any screen tests where for like big roles
12:34that you just, you just, the roles that got away.
12:36Where I would have liked to play?
12:38Yeah, yeah, yeah.
12:39Or that you were kind of up for the running.
12:41I did get the role.
12:42It was going to be a smaller budget movie.
12:44It was Oliver Stone's Platoon.
12:46I did audition on, you know, videotape, I guess.
12:50And I got the role that eventually Willem Dafoe ended up playing.
12:55And, and I assumed I had that role.
12:58I kept saying, when are we shooting?
12:59And, you know, I didn't know much about the business.
13:01He goes, well, we're still looking.
13:02We'll have to raise the rest of the money.
13:03And, but, you know, and nobody told me it wasn't happening.
13:07And so I spent like a year reading every possible thing about Vietnam.
13:12I even thought, could I like join the army just for a short while?
13:16No, it doesn't work that way.
13:18You know, but I got as much experience as I could about it.
13:22And I really filled notebooks.
13:24I had this character.
13:24I was ready, you know.
13:26And then one day I read in the newspaper, yeah, Oliver Stone's making this movie
13:30and Tom Berringer, Tom Berringer, that's the one who was playing it.
13:33And, and Willem Dafoe, and I'm like playing, you know, and so I called Oliver Stone.
13:40And I said, what's going on?
13:41I thought, what's, because, well, you know, what's a bigger budget now?
13:45And, you know, Willem Dafoe was just in, I don't know what, to live and die in LA or whatever.
13:50And, and, you know, and I don't know how he explained it, but he was basically,
13:55no, it's just not going to happen.
13:57And I said, oh, because I thought, you know, I'm really ready.
14:00Could I do another audition just to prove that I'm, because I know even more now than I did when I got the part.
14:05Yeah, no, it's not going to happen.
14:07But I wouldn't have done the other things I've done if that had happened.
14:12And if I'd had that sort of initial success,
14:16maybe I would have got tired of the whole thing already and quit.
14:20So part of the journey, isn't it?
14:22Yeah.