Gov. Kathy Hochul (D-NY) spoke with parents about her plan to restrict social media for kids and teens in New York, and the harms of addictive algorithms on popular social media platforms.
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NewsTranscript
00:00social media and the addictive algorithms that really govern the platform is where our children
00:05spend so much their lives. And what is so disturbing to me is that really seems to be
00:12taking over their lives and governing their mental health as well. And I know there's a lot of
00:18parents on this call. I want to thank our great commissioner, Dr. Ann Sullivan, the Office of
00:23Mental Health for what she is doing to champion this issue. But I think it's not a secret to
00:28anyone that I'm the first mom to be governor of New York. I'm also a fairly new grandmother. And
00:34you know, we all know that we really want our kids to be safe, protected, and we cannot fail
00:41them in this. And this is something where a lot of times parents and teenagers disagree on things,
00:48but I'm really starting to see a change in the attitudes of the young people we've spoken to.
00:54This is something that teenagers and parents are agreeing on. And a lot of these young people know
01:01that they're feeling lonelier and isolated and anxiety and depression like they never have
01:08before. Perhaps even their older siblings might not have because they are in this generational
01:13collide here where they're the first generation in 100 years to be dealing with the effects of
01:19a global pandemic which created incredible isolation. It had to. They were on their own.
01:24They're at home. Their only social connections were through social media. But also then this
01:30rise in the addictive algorithms. And we really can see where there's a close connection between
01:37these influences and the onslaught of low self-esteem and desperation and depression and,
01:44you know, social media platforms like Instagram and TikTok and they just keep pulling our kids
01:49into this virtual darkness. And they need help. This is not from me. This is literally from them
01:57and I cannot ignore the fact that I remember this voice so clearly when a young woman said,
02:03you have to save us from ourselves. We need you to help us put this down because
02:09the peer pressure is so powerful that they can't say, well, I know this is not good for me. I need
02:15to focus on my work during the school day. I'm going to be the one person in my class who doesn't
02:20engage. That is a death sentence for our kids. They cannot be that one person or that small
02:25group of people because of the incredible pressure. So we said enough is enough. Last
02:31October, I was joined by our Attorney General Tish James, Senator Andrew Glenardus and Assemblymember
02:37Nellie Rosick and parents, many of you represented, parents from across New York, and we announced
02:42that we had legislation that would prohibit minors from being exposed to addictive social media
02:49algorithms and dangerous feeds and protect them from online entities collecting and making money
02:56off their personal data for a teenager, minor. So this is my top priority at the end of session,
03:03just a few days left. If we don't listen to them and give more power back to parents as well to be
03:10able to shut it all off at midnight till 6 a.m., our kids are sleep deprived. This affects their
03:15ability to be resilient to the stresses of the next day. They need their rest. If we, as the
03:21elected adults and the adults who care deeply about them from all across New York, if we don't
03:26listen to their cries for help and see the damning data, then we have failed in one of our most
03:32important, but I would say instinctive responsibilities, our duties, which is to keep our children safe.
03:38So we've had a big overhaul of the mental health system since I became governor two years ago,
03:43safeguarding kids as a centerpiece of that, $1 billion for mental health, and we've been expanding
03:49mental health for young people dealing with eating disorders, for example, and youth suicide
03:55prevention, $10 million. And what's so important to me is opening more school-based clinics
04:01because I've been to them and I've talked to young people who say they never would have been
04:05able to get help or an adult who understands if it was left up to their parents to take time off
04:11their jobs during the school day, drive sometimes a great distance to find a provider, try to do
04:16this every week for a long time, it never would have happened. So this is the reality. You help
04:22the young people in school, starting whether it's in middle school or high school, and if we can
04:28identify and stop some of this negativity and these mental health challenges while they're young,
04:34we can save them from a lifetime of needing care. And that's what I want to do. So we're going to
04:39have over 1,200 around the state, these school-based clinics, every child who wants to access help and
04:45their parents who want them to get help should have it. So with these bills, we're in the home
04:49stretch. We're building on that progress. We're treating these symptoms that cause so much distress
04:56as an outgrowth of this. And I want to thank all of you for joining us. I want to hear your voices
05:02and your experiences. And as you answer the question, I thank Kyle for being our moderator
05:07today, because I will do my job better from listening to the people like all of you who care
05:12so deeply who have joined us here today. So let me let Kyle take it away. Thank you.
05:19Thank you, Governor. And Kyle Belagupitsky from New York State PTA. And on behalf of the parents
05:23and families of our 2.6 million school children, we truly applaud your work on this critical issue.
05:29In our recent mental health survey for parents, families, and educators, respondents were asked
05:34which youth mental health issues were most important in facing our students today. And the
05:39results were alarming. 82.1% of respondents felt that social media was the most important health
05:46issue facing our students. And that's why we're here. So Governor, today we have parents and
05:51parent advocates from around the state joining us to talk about this critical issue, and how we can
05:56work together to really best support our children. And we're going to dig in for this next 45 minutes.
06:00This question is going to be first for Stephanie Stevens. She is president of the YWCA of New York
06:06State and executive director of the YWCA of Westfield. Stephanie, you have two kids, and I know
06:11what that's like. What kind of concern do you have when it comes to keeping them safe on social media?
06:17And why do you feel this is such an important issue for protecting them
06:21in their mental health and well-being?
06:27Come off mute there. Thank you for having me. Thank you, Kyle, and thank you, Governor Hochul,
06:31for having me. I am in your hometown here, Western New York. Nice and sunny today. So
06:38that's definitely good for our kids' mental health, as well as the parents'.
06:42So I sent this question out to some of my peers and colleagues and my family members, my own kids.
06:49My kids are older now, 18 and 24, so we've kind of been through every stage of the social media
06:57process between my kids, their friends, and now being able to look back and seeing, oh, this is
07:04what we could have done better. And, you know, the first thing that comes to mind is, you know,
07:09the rules and regulations us parents have, you know, screen time should be this and put the phone
07:14in here and don't let them be on it. Well, then they go to their friend's house and they get on
07:19it. Then, you know, they sneak their phone, they get on it. So what we really need to do, in my
07:25opinion, being a mother for 24 years, is educate our kids on how to use it and what is right and
07:35what is wrong. And, you know, the people that they're seeing on social media are not experts
07:41and they are not the end all be all. Now, you know, some parents, you have to lead by example.
07:48You can't have your phone on in front of you. You can't always be on it. And I'm not saying that
07:53I'm the best role model for that, but I try to be present in the moment, set my phone down.
07:58When a family comes over, they laugh at me because a lot of times I put it in the cupboard.
08:02So I forget where it is. So then, you know, after one leaves, I'm looking for my phone for
08:06a good half hour, stuff like that. You know, what I would like to really, really touch on that I
08:14think is the most important is keeping your kids active, keeping them, whether it be in sports,
08:21whether it be in clubs. And, you know, you don't need to be around them all the time because
08:27they're not going to listen to your opinions. If you say social media is bad, get off that phone.
08:32They're going to be, no, no, I'm going to do what I want. But, you know, if you send them
08:36to somewhere like an after school program, the YWCA Boys and Girls Club, and you get them involved
08:43in that stuff, and not because you have to, not because you're working and you need to send them
08:48there, but because it's a good space for them and it's a good place for them to find mentors
08:54on what they should and should not be doing. So you send them somewhere, they're playing basketball,
08:59they're being busy, they're running around, they're networking in person, meeting new friends.
09:04And, you know, they get some pretty good role models. They get teams that work in the program
09:10and that are helping, and they don't have their phones. And they are talking about, oh,
09:16this TikTok where you don't want to listen to them or, you know, things like that. And
09:21they're not on the phone. They're tired when they get home. Then when they get home,
09:25you know, you give them a couple hours on their phone. Then you take it,
09:29you charge it in your room at night, and you give it back to them after school.
09:33And I think we're giving kids their privileges a little bit too early, too. My daughter will tell
09:39you, I didn't let her have a phone until 13. I didn't let her have social media, I'm sorry,
09:44until she was 13. So, you know, keeping our children young and innocent as long as we can,
09:49I think, helps a lot, too. So, I think my take on all this, being a mom of older children now,
09:57and being able to reflect back, is keeping them busy. Put them in the programs. It doesn't mean
10:02that you're a bad mom because, oh, well, I'm home, why am I sending my kids off? They need that.
10:08They need to be around other people, and they need to be active, and they need to be outside,
10:15and they need to be in the programs. So, that's definitely my take on that.
10:21Stephanie, I really appreciated that comment, especially about the one about taking the phone
10:25at night. I think, as the Governor mentioned, it's often children are on their phones in the
10:30evening hours, and they're not getting sleep. So, that was fantastic advice. I'm going to
10:34transition now to Kathleen Spence. She is a parent and educator who knows, unfortunately,
10:39the harms that toxic social media content can cause. Kathleen, you've spoken really powerfully
10:44about the impact that this has had on your daughter. If you were talking right now to a
10:49social media company executive about their addictive algorithms, what would you tell them,
10:55and what do you think they need to know, really, from one parent and educator to the company?
11:00This is really an excellent question. My daughter and I were both present at the January 31st U.S.
11:06Senate Online Child Safety Hearing, and Mark Zuckerberg was strong-armed into telling us
11:12face-to-face, quote, I'm sorry for everything that you have gone through. Well, I would like
11:17to tell him that his apology was fake and insincere. If he valued our most precious commodity,
11:26our future youth, then he wouldn't view them as a product of $270. My daughter's life and the
11:34children that I work with are worth more than $270 apiece. If Meta and other social media
11:41companies cared about our future generations, then they would turn off the dark algorithm that
11:48draws them into doom-scrolling. They would turn off late-night notification and stop
11:55the addictive nature of their platform. They would turn off notifications during school hours
12:01so that children can receive uninterrupted education. They need to give children
12:09and the users easier availability for safety options, such as the ability to easily turn off
12:16the algorithm and limit who can private message them. It shouldn't be a secret on finding these
12:22features. Most importantly, they need to start putting mental health of our future generation
12:29first. I would tell these companies to stop data-collecting information on our youth and
12:35selling it to third-party companies and turning our children and my daughter into a product.
12:42I challenge the CEOs of the big five companies to come spend one week in my middle school in New
12:50York to see firsthand how the social media is destroying the social and emotional
12:57well-being of our future. Most importantly, I want the big five CEOs to remember that our children
13:08are not in danger of their harmful algorithm. Here are just some of the names that have been
13:19lost as a result of their harmful algorithm. I want them to know their names.
13:26England Roberts, Selena Rodriguez, Alexandra Neville, Mason Eden, Zachary Narzio, Tanner
13:35Jensen, Carson Bride, CJ Dawley, and Chase Nascar. Those are just a few of the thousands of children
13:44in our country that have been lost at the hands of the algorithm of social media. Social media
13:51companies need to stop putting their profits and start putting children first. Enough is enough.
13:58We demand change now. Kathleen, thank you for those very powerful words. From one mom to another,
14:05I know how important your voice is and your daughter's voice. Thank you for all the work
14:10that you do on behalf of families. We're going to transition now to talk to Scott. Scott is
14:17co-founder. Scott McCloud is co-founder of the Sophie Fund. Scott, you know firsthand the
14:22devastating impact of what can happen when a young person becomes too overwhelmed by the harmful
14:27forces around them. What do you think we should know about how to support and provide care
14:33to our youth who really need it most, Scott?
14:39And Scott, you're on mute, so if you could take yourself off mute, that would be fantastic.
14:43And Scott McCloud, thank you. Sorry about that. Thank you, Governor. Thank you, everybody here.
14:51We established the Sophie Fund after the suicide of our daughter, Sophie, who was a Cornell
14:58University student at the time. Our efforts are aimed at the local community in Tompkins County,
15:04the state of New York, including the college campuses. We want to do everything we can to
15:08advance better mental health support for our young people. We also co-founded the Bullying
15:13Prevention Task Force in Tompkins County after the suicide death of one of our young students
15:19who had experienced severe bullying. One of the things this task force has done is
15:24given a lot of programming to the community, including parents and school staff, on cyber
15:30bullying. The national data on young people's mental health is alarming, and we see this in
15:36Tompkins County. We had a survey in 2023 of students grades 6 through 12. 35 percent said
15:44they felt sad or depressed on most days. It's just unbelievable. 34 percent said they sometimes felt
15:51that life wasn't worth it. At Cornell, student surveys have shown that depression, stress,
15:57or anxiety have prevented nearly half of undergraduates from functioning academically
16:02for at least a week during their school year. I think there's a lot more we can all be doing. In
16:09general, I would say there's a serious lack of resources. We really appreciate the governor's
16:13efforts in this regard. It's going to take everything we've got. Let me just focus on the
16:18opportunities for schools, which is an area we've done a lot of work with. It's important, I think,
16:25to recognize the need for systemic improvement. Schools must be more proactive. They must make
16:31supporting student mental health a priority. We need proactive work, not just crisis management.
16:37We need to encourage help-seeking behavior and not perpetuate stigma by discussing mental health
16:44in whispers. This means that schools need to honestly and proactively educate their school
16:50community about mental health, about suicide, about bullying, and that includes educating the students
16:57themselves, school staff, teachers, and especially the parents. This means meaningful programming for
17:04students and for parents. It means having open conversations collectively and individually with
17:11parents. It also means training school staff and especially school psychologists and social
17:17workers in bullying prevention and in suicide prevention. I think the governor's initiative on
17:24training in mental health first aid is incredibly important. This is exactly what we need
17:31more of. Best practices exist, but we need schools to be following them.
17:39And, Scott, I know the work that you do to carry on Sophie's name is so powerful.
17:43During the pandemic, we saw, unfortunately, and post-pandemic, suicidal ideation of youth, as you
17:49know, unfortunately continue to increase, and it is a continuing concern. So, thank you for the work
17:54that you do on behalf of your daughter and all of the work you do in Tompkins County. Governor, I'm
17:59going to put you on the spot a little bit. So far, we've heard from Stephanie, Kathleen, and Scott, all
18:04with really powerful stories, this critical voice, this parent voice on what's happening to our youth
18:09and social media. Do you have some initial thoughts? No, this just simply reinforces that we're on the
18:16right path, that not just the parents and the voices we've heard already, and we'll hear in a
18:21couple more minutes, representing their life's experiences, but the thousands of families,
18:27millions of people out there across the country who are asking for some answer to this. They don't
18:33want to end up with a teenager who emerges into their 20s who's really not as healthy mentally
18:43as they would have been but for these influences. I mean, we want all of our children to be
18:48successful, put them on that path where there's no barriers to doing whatever they want to do. It's
18:53just hardwired in everyone as a parent to think like this, and then you see these forces that you
18:58can't control out there having this negative impact, and your once joyful child has emerged
19:05into a darker being who just wants to be alone in their room all the time, and, you know, if you
19:10drag them to dinner table, they're sitting there going like this all through the dinner table.
19:15We lose them. We lose their souls. We have to bring them back, and so these voices thus far
19:21have already motivated me to stay the course we're on because I don't want to be judged by history
19:27later and say you were the generation who saw the effects and you didn't do anything about it. I
19:32can't live with that. The people on this call can't live with this, and so I appreciate everybody
19:37lending their voice in the media. Amplifying this is important to overcome the forces against what
19:44we're trying to do, and they are powerful, but there's nothing more powerful than a parent's
19:50nature, their intuitive nature to protect their children. That is what's going to prevail in the
19:56next couple of days here, so thank you. And we agree, Governor. New York's APTA is from 1897
20:02old, so we would agree with you. There's nothing more powerful than that parent voice, and I'm so
20:06glad to be here with these fantastic parents. We're going to transition to Bernice Tsai now,
20:11our colleague from Common Sense Media and a parent advocate. Bernice, you've worked so hard as an
20:17advocate to counteract the dangers posed to kids these days by harmful digital content and Common
20:23Sense Media. What are you concerned about the fact that these companies are collecting and selling
20:28personal data of minors? What does that look like? Well, thank you for allowing me to be here, and I
20:33just have to say, Governor Hoko, I'm so impressed with the research you've done and how much you
20:38know on this topic. It's great to know that you're an advocate for us. I'm the mom to a 15-year-old
20:44daughter, and I remember when my daughter got her first phone when she was 11, and she would say to
20:52me, oh, it's so boring when we get together with our friends. Everybody's just on their phones.
20:57I'd rather be playing games. I'd rather be doing stuff, and I thought to myself, oh, this is great.
21:03She knows that it's not healthy to be online all day. She'd rather be with her friends engaging,
21:10but I was naive because I didn't realize that she was up against big tech, and within less than a
21:16year, she became like her friends and many others in her generation. She basically became addicted
21:22and hypnotized by social media and began spending all of her time on her phone in her room in the
21:30dark, as you said, and why does this happen? This is why I'm worried about the data collection piece
21:35because she quickly got converted because of the data that was being collected on her.
21:42The algorithms that are keeping our kids online, they run on fuel, and that fuel is our children's
21:49information. It's their data. It's information about every move they're making, everything that
21:55they look at, everything they like, their feelings, where they are every moment of the day, if their
22:01location services are on, and I read in a recent research study that by the time a child is 13,
22:10over 70 million pieces of data might have been already collected on them, which is
22:15outrageous. Tech companies are essentially stalking our kids, and for some reason until now, we really
22:23haven't had the collective will to say stop. That's not only wrong, but it's kind of sick.
22:29It's stalking, right, and to be honest, most kids don't really understand what's happening to them
22:34online. They have no clue that they're being followed and traced and tracked. If I can share
22:41a quick story, a few weeks ago, my daughter found out that a young man at her school who had a crush
22:47on her had sort of become a little obsessed and was sort of demonstrating his interest in her
22:53in some strange ways, including he had begun to secretly follow her home from school. So as you
22:59can imagine, our family became worried, and we contacted the school, and within the hour, the
23:05principal, the head of security, the head of students were on a conference call with us,
23:10assuring us they were going to protect our daughter. They were going to talk to the young
23:14man, make sure he understood that following her without her consent, without her knowing,
23:19was inappropriate. It was not acceptable. It's not what we do in our society, and basically,
23:27the adults rallied together quickly without hesitation to make sure my daughter was protected
23:32and that she wouldn't continue to be followed and monitored by someone that she didn't know
23:37or really want to have done, have doing that. So imagine that. That's, you know, this idea of a
23:44child being stalked or followed unknowingly is disturbing, right? It's not something that
23:50any of us would feel comfortable with, knowing that that was happening to our children, and yet
23:55that is actually what's happening every day to our kids online. Every hour, every move they're making
24:02is being tracked, and just because it's happening online and it's invisible, we've somehow normalized
24:09that it's okay, and it's really not. In the physical world, we would never allow that to
24:14happen, and so it's the same sort of situation. All of our kids, including my daughter, deserve
24:21to be protected by adults, not exploited, not have their data traded on so that others can make money
24:29and that that data can be used to manipulate them, control them, make them feel bad about themselves,
24:36you know, separate them from their families, from their friends, from the people who care about them,
24:41just so that someone at big tech can make a buck. It's really that disturbing that
24:48they're allowed to do that on the backs of our children. So, as I know you know, this data
24:54privacy bill hasn't been updated in 25 years. 25 years ago, the internet didn't exist, social media
25:00didn't exist, iPhones didn't exist. It's time to catch up and make sure that we're doing what we can
25:06to protect this next generation, because one generation has already been suffering and
25:12potentially lost, and we can't let that happen again. So, I just want to thank you so much for
25:17being involved and being a champion for this. Thank you. Bernice, thank you for that powerful story,
25:23and it's very important to share these stories with everyone, and thank you for doing that today.
25:29Governor, how do these stories help shape these last four days of session, these last five days
25:35of session? We're really at the end of session at this point, and we have these very important
25:39social media bills to protect children, and what does that look like for you? Well, it's doing
25:44events like this, but also doing more roundtables and speaking out and trying to, you know, bring
25:51the press attention in a positive way on what we're doing. I just did an NPR interview, for example,
25:56nationwide, and I think this really should be a national standard. We'll fight hard in New York,
26:02but just like other issues where the federal government is not up to the task, and especially
26:08our Congress that doesn't seem to want to take actions to protect citizens in many areas,
26:14this is where state governors have to step up. So, what I want to do is use the voices we're
26:19hearing here, let them continue to be amplified, and really try to get into the bloodstream of
26:28what people are talking about here in Albany, and I believe it's happening. You know, this is
26:32the power of my bully pulpit, so to speak, that I could just be sustained and unrelenting in my
26:39pursuit to get this done, work with our legislative leaders. Our teams are in constant communication
26:44all day long on this issue, and hopefully come out with the result that we can be proud of,
26:49and not succumb to the pressures that are very powerful. And so, this is a moment where
26:56we have to stand up and be successful, and then say to other states, some of you have tried,
27:01you didn't get quite as far as us, or other states haven't attempted. This is the way you do it. New
27:06York is going to lead in this space, because there's nothing more important to us than our
27:11children and their health. And we appreciate your leadership on this. I know you have a partner in
27:16all of us on this call. And we'll talk now to Dr. Misha Porter. She is President and CEO of the
27:23Bronx Community Foundation. Misha, you've dealt with a lot in your previous role as Chancellor,
27:29as a mom, and in your new role at the Bronx Community Foundation. How are you addressing
27:33the issues around the inequities in the Bronx? What problems have you encountered as it relates
27:38really to online education, and most importantly, certainly for us, parent engagement? That's so
27:43critical. Yeah, thank you, Kyle and Governor Hochul for this important conversation. And to all the
27:48champions for children on this call, I'm just honored to be in your presence. In addition to
27:53leading New York City public schools during a tremendously critical time, when schools shut
27:58down in March of 2021, I was also the mom of a high school student, a freshman, a senior dance
28:04major in her last year of college, and a middle school teacher who were all grappling with remote
28:09learning and the social disconnect from school. I had conversations with so many parents and
28:14students who talked about how much they struggled through remote learning. And watching students
28:19across the city grapple through the pandemic, I knew that one of the most important things that I
28:23could do, that we could do, was to ensure that we were positioning to safely reopen and bring our
28:28babies back to in-person learning. And you know, for me, school is the center of community. And so
28:34centering resources at the building level to support our students' mental health is critically
28:39important. And I'm so glad to hear what you're doing, Governor. Now I'm leading the Bronx
28:43Community Foundation, the first and only community foundation in the Bronx, solely dedicated to
28:48delivering resources to the borough. Our work is to eradicate inequities and build sustainable
28:53futures for all Bronxites through grantmaking, convening, and focusing on strategic program
28:58partnerships in education and digital equity. The Bronx has the lowest broadband adoption rates of
29:04any borough, and the disparities are even more pronounced at the neighborhood level, with 38%
29:09of my neighbors not having access to broadband. What this tells me is that in the pandemic,
29:14there was a lack of access to high quality education, food, health care. We had the lowest
29:19PPP loans in the borough, and so on and so on. And because of this, we formed the Bronx Digital
29:25Equity Coalition to combat deep-rooted disparities in our community. In addition, the foundation has
29:31supported the launch of the Gigabit Center at the Andrew Friedman Home, which brings Wi-Fi, device
29:36access, and digital literacy programs to community members who struggle with digital access and
29:41literacy. Nearly one in five teens can't finish their homework because of the digital divide,
29:46and roughly one-third of households with children ages 6 to 17, whose annual incomes fall below
29:54$30,000 a year, don't have access to high-speed internet connections at home. And as it relates
29:59to parents, what we did see in the pandemic was actually an increase in parent engagement because
30:04there were multiple ways for working parents to connect to school. However, ensuring connectivity
30:09is critical to this continuing. So because of the lack of connectivity, students have become
30:15reliant on their phones, and so we have to solve for this. So in addition to the increase in school-based
30:22health clinics, which is so important, and I'm such a cheerleader for those school-based health care
30:29providers, we also need to create phone-free spaces in our schools and a program and partner to help
30:35facilitate this. Governor, it's already happening. In the Bronx, at MS 180, at New Pathways Academy, and at
30:42the Bronx School for Law, Government, and Justice, they're using pouches to ensure that their students
30:49are talking to each other and not on the internet throughout the school day. And Governor,
30:55you're right. Our babies aren't offering up their phones, but they're definitely recognizing the
31:00difference it makes in their ability to learn and connect to each other when they don't have them.
31:06And I can't tell you the excitement that principals have about hearing student voices in the cafeteria.
31:11Yet, as we do this important work, we must also ensure that we don't leave the Bronx out and we
31:17close the digital divide that exists in our borough and provide schools with the appropriate
31:22tools to support 21st century learning, which is not about devices, but about access and innovation
31:28through the intersection of teachers, students, and 21st century tech tools working together to deepen
31:35human connections. We need to take a human-centered approach to technology, which prioritizes human
31:41needs and values. And I would say, Governor, you'd also appreciate my mom, who's also a teacher,
31:47makes us put up our phones on Sundays at Sunday dinner, modeling the importance of our family and
31:52our family connections. Dr. Porter, on behalf of those about 900,000 students in New York City,
31:58thank you for what you did for them during the pandemic. And thank you for what you do in the
32:02Bronx for parents and families and children. So I know we'll continue to work together.
32:06We're going to transition now to Julie Scalfo, who is founder and executive director of Mothers
32:12Against Media Addiction, such an important group. Julie, what stories are you hearing from mothers
32:17across your network? How are they struggling, really, with seeing their kids getting hooked on
32:22toxic algorithms? And what steps are they taking to speak out and make sure that we in government,
32:28those in government, can really act to protect them? Thank you, Kyle. And thank you to the
32:33Governor for convening us this morning. For those who don't know, Mothers Against Media Addiction,
32:39or MAMA, is a grassroots movement of parents fighting back against media addiction and
32:44creating a world in which real life experiences and interactions remain at the heart of a healthy
32:50childhood. Every day, I hear from concerned parents about how their children are glued to
32:55their screens. As a mother of three, this is something I've experienced firsthand. And having
33:01spent most of my career as a journalist, I'm motivated by facts. And the facts are clear.
33:06We are in a national emergency in youth and adolescent mental health. And we need to deal
33:11with the underlying causes now. Our kids' compulsion to check their phones is inhibiting their
33:17development, distracting them from learning in class, and limiting their opportunities for
33:22in-person interactions with their peers. Screen time isn't just harmful. It's eliminating critical
33:29interpersonal experiences during childhood and adolescence, a time when kids are supposed to
33:34interact. They're supposed to learn how to conduct themselves. And they're supposed to have plenty of
33:38time for play and all the embodied learning that comes with it. Now, we have this unprecedented
33:44youth mental health crisis. It's wreaking havoc on our kids. It's devastating families. And it's
33:50being fueled by these harmful and addictive algorithms and content that young people are
33:56seeing on social media every day. According to the U.S. Surgeon General, most adolescents are
34:02spending more than three and a half hours daily on social media, a level that puts them at much
34:09greater risk of experiencing poor mental health outcomes. Their behavior is dangerous. And it's
34:15not safe to let them continue. Our MAMA network has been at the forefront of urging our elected
34:21leaders to enact basic safeguards, such as the bills in the New York legislature that are being
34:27considered right now, and we hope they pass this week, to protect our kids from the harms of social
34:34media. We've been rallying in Albany and in New York City, including a rally outside of MEDA's
34:39Manhattan offices, calling for policies to ensure that kids have online privacy protections and to
34:46prevent social media companies from targeting them with hidden algorithms that exploit their
34:50emotions for profit. For any parents, teachers, or other concerned adults who want to get involved in
34:56this effort, please go to joinmama.org to become part of our movement. Together, with the work
35:03being done by Governor Hochul and others and everyone in this call, we can create a future
35:09where all kids experience a healthy, balanced childhood in a world where technology serves
35:15humanity, not the other way around. Julie, thank you. I know there's a lot of mothers on this Zoom,
35:20so we appreciate all of the work that you do. We're going to transition now to Jenny Dembro,
35:25who is the Executive Director and Co-Founder of the Lower East Side Girls Club.
35:29Jenny, you work closely with teen girls in a wide variety of programming. I know this is a group that
35:35really has been hit hard by harmful effects of social media. What are you hearing from teen
35:40girls about the way that social media content is impacting the feelings of self-worth, and how are
35:45you addressing this at your girls club? I will get into that, but first off, I just wanted to say,
35:51Governor Hochul, it's great to see you again. It feels like a lifetime ago that you hosted
35:56The Future is Female, Making a Difference in Our Communities and in Congress in 2018
36:01at the Girls Club. And in April 2020, at the height of the pandemic, you visited our New
36:06Girls City cohort via Zoom. We are so grateful that you are not only amplifying this issue,
36:12but providing critical funding to address mental health issues amongst youth. I'm honored to be
36:16with you all today. I've been with the Girls Club since our founding in 1996, and I can clearly
36:22delineate before social media and after the harmful effects on our members and the toll it is
36:28taking on their mental health. Remember when you were a kid and bullying happened in school?
36:33Now it can be 24-7 with people who have never even met you. Between COVID isolation and social
36:39media, we have witnessed young people retreating and wanting to disconnect from the real world.
36:44In my 28 years working at a youth-serving organization, I have never experienced the
36:49level of mental health issues we are seeing today. But there is hope. Girls Club provides
36:55a space filled with love, attention, and care, a space to create and build on face-to-face
37:00relationships where our addictive devices are put away. Social connectedness is the antidote
37:06to isolation. Girls Club offers mentors, nourishment, rest, someone to listen to you.
37:12Members experience a sense of belonging, strengthen social skills, build supportive
37:17peer groups, and engage with staff and mentors who encourage, challenge, and care for them.
37:22We listen to our youth. They feel seen and heard. Mental well-being is woven through every one of
37:28our programs. We have a phenomenal social worker who provides direct support to members and their
37:32families, and it's not just counseling that we offer. We have teen and pre-teen restorative
37:37circles where members share experiences and receive support. Members practice self-care
37:43and develop habits for a lifelong health. Passion and joy. Our members thrive as they
37:48explore interests, discover and pursue their creative passions, choosing from over 40 weekly
37:53programs in the arts, media, music, dance, STEM, design, civic engagement, gardening, wellness,
38:00and more. Young people need hope and the ability to envision a brighter future for themselves and
38:05their community like we all do. That is what we do at the Lower East Side Girls Club. It's a space
38:11to turn off the devices and connect in real life. As one of our members expressed last year,
38:17we are a light of hope for young people, and thank you so much.
38:23Jenny, thanks for the important work that you do on behalf of all of, you know, mothers of
38:28teen children. You know, it's fantastic. Governor, we've heard a lot about, especially, the impact
38:35on teens and teen girls in particular on the last few speakers. How does that impact, you know,
38:41your decision on moving forward on this legislation? Well, it's continuing to motivate me, that's for
38:47sure. There's no way we're going to throw in the towel when I hear the voices on this call. I mean,
38:50there's people relying on us, and I was also interested in what Dr. Porter was talking about,
38:56about, you know, this digital divide, which is deeply concerning to me, that there should be,
39:01you know, laptops, iPads in schools, so young people don't have to think that their only way
39:07to have this connection is through their own smartphone. I have thrown out an idea. It's not
39:13fully developed, but, you know, this comes from sitting with young people. Like, what would a
39:18school day be like where the young people didn't have this distraction going on all day long, and
39:25they're actually looking eye-to-eye with other students at lunchtime or listening to the teacher
39:31directly instead of having their head down, and I'm going to be pursuing this. I want to get this
39:36done first. I want to talk to more parents and educators about concerns about smartphones. Do
39:43they need to be in schools? If you need to have a connection because of, you know, we all have that
39:48terror, terrible image of a school shooting and wanting to be able to connect and make sure your
39:53child's okay. I understand that, but lip phones do that too. You know, it doesn't have to be hooked
40:00up to a smartphone, which then opens up the entire world of distraction. It allows you to have what
40:06the parents want, is that ability to reach you, and you can set that aside, and that's not going
40:11to be luring you in all day long when you have to be focusing on your studies. That's the purpose of
40:16school and socialization in person, so I'm just inspired by these stories, and I would say it's
40:24very motivating for me, and, you know, I know who's counting on us, counting us in the right thing here.
40:30Yeah, we agree, Governor, and I know the next speaker, who happens to be a clinical licensed
40:34social worker, is going to have a unique perspective. Erin Muller is founder of Modify Wellness.
40:39You help individuals and families who are really struggling to overcome obstacles in their lives.
40:45In your work with clients, what connections have you seen between the distractions of social media
40:49and mental health symptoms, like depression and anxiety, because we saw that too in our mental
40:54health survey, particularly among young people. What does that look like, Erin? Yes, thank you, Kyle,
41:00and thank you, Governor Hochul, for this very critical conversation. So, as a therapist, I have noticed
41:05significant connections between social media use and mental health amongst our youth. Depression
41:11and anxiety, especially, has grown tremendously. Social media often creates a platform for constant
41:18comparison, leading to feelings of inadequacy and low self-esteem. The curated and often idealized
41:24portrayals of other people's lives can make users feel as if they're not really matching up.
41:31Additionally, the pervasive nature of social media can contribute to poor academic performance,
41:36sleep disturbances, and contribute to anxiety. The pressure to feel constantly available and
41:42responsive can lead to stress and a sense of overwhelm. The fear of missing out also plays
41:48a critical role exacerbating anxieties as individuals feel compelled to stay engaged
41:54and keep up with their peers. Moreover, cyberbullying and negative interactions online
42:01can lead to increased feelings of isolation, increased suicide rates, and depression.
42:06The anonymity of social media can sometimes embolden negative behavior that individuals
42:12may not exhibit in face-to-face interactions. While social media has some positive aspects,
42:18such as fostering connections, providing support, there are the negative effects that's affecting
42:24our youth's mental health, particularly amongst our school age and adolescents. Significant
42:30attention is needed in policy, management strategies, empowering our parents who may
42:36not be aware, which would benefit them through a robust campaign so they can understand
42:43the dangers of social media to their parents. A lot of parents are not aware
42:48of what's happening because they're busy with work, busy with their own lives,
42:52just trying to navigate and get through. So thank you so much, Governor Hoko, for this conversation.
42:58And that's it. Erin, thank you for that important perspective. I know Elise Gold,
43:05who's founder of the Maya Gold Foundation, is going to speak next. Elise, you launched your
43:11foundation to honor Maya's memory and bring more attention to the social pressures young people
43:16face that Erin was just discussing. In your work with the foundation, what have you heard from
43:22other teens and families and families of teens who are struggling with youth mental health?
43:27And what can those in government and our stakeholders do to really help them?
43:33Again, thank you both, Kyle, Governor. And it is also an honor, and I'm so inspired to sit
43:40side by side, all of you who are doing such good work throughout the state.
43:44We have heard so much from the teens that we work with. We do not do any work without them there.
43:50In fact, the first question I had when I was invited is, can I bring a teen? We hear a lot.
43:56When many of them have suffered through mental health challenges and crises, many of them feel
44:03gifted and blessed enough that they have the supports they need. And many of them also recognize
44:10that the supports are not there for so many. And there is so much stigma that people don't
44:16talk about it. I'm going to address three issues when it comes to what can the government do to
44:24support. And one of them, Governor Hochul, you hit straight on school-based clinics. Bravo to you to
44:32be naming that and recognizing that. School social workers and guidance counselors have their hands
44:38full with directing kids to college or figuring out schedules. They're not often there. There's
44:46not enough resources for the mental health needs. So to bring in clinics, we have learned, has been
44:53effective. So if there's any way that the government can find good therapists, because that's also
44:59a key, to be in the schools where it can be made more affordable, as another
45:07mentioned that parents often don't have time or means to take their kids to clinics or
45:14therapists outside of school hours, that would be brilliant. Two, education. Helping to break
45:22the stigma. I know, Scott, you mentioned Youth Mental Health First Aid. We, the Michael Foundation,
45:29are big proponents of both Youth Mental Health First Aid and Teen Mental Health First Aid.
45:35Teen Mental Health First Aid, both of these are managed by the National Council of Mental
45:39Well-Being Evidence-Based Programs. In the case of Teen Mental Health First Aid, teens often, of course,
45:46we were all teens, listen to teens more so than adults. So we give teens the tools to recognize
45:53when they themselves or others are experiencing mental health challenges or crisis, not only
46:00recognizing it, but then what to do, like first aid. Stop the bleeding while calling the ambulance.
46:06I don't do the stitching up. Let the experts do that. So when it comes to experts to be sure to
46:13have for every teen, for every youth to have a trusted, compassionate adult that they can turn to
46:19in their life, that's a very strong protective factor in the life of an adolescence. And third,
46:26so Teen Mental Health First Aid would be for the teens themselves. Youth Mental Health First Aid
46:32is for adults who are working with youth so they can learn signs, signals, symptoms, and what to do.
46:39Because we all see it, but yeah. And last is access. We know, of course, there's always a need for
46:46more services, but here in the Hudson Valley, for instance, Ulster County is where I'm based,
46:52there's wonderful resources, thank goodness, but teens don't know how to access it. If they're in
46:58crisis or facing a challenge, how do they, you know, like go through the myriads of websites and
47:06services out there? What does half of this stuff even mean to the teens? So if there were a simple
47:12place to put on the phone, you know, click a QR code and then put in, you know, what's your problem?
47:20Or whether it's substance use or teen-dedicating violence or self-harm or suicidal thoughts,
47:28just to really hone in, make it, yes, resources are out there, but make it accessible without
47:36having to do scrolling. If you're in a crisis, you're not, that's not going to be the time to
47:41start research. So those are my three takeaways, education, resources, and easier access. And I
47:50just say bravo to the good work that you are doing and that we all are doing. Thank you for giving me
47:55the opportunity to be here. Thanks, Lynn. I think those are fantastic points, especially the Youth
48:01Mental Health First Aid. I know our entire governance team is actually taking the Mahaney's
48:05course right now because it's really important. So I suggest everyone who's watching at home to
48:10check out a local Youth Mental Health First Aid class. You can take it online or in person, really,
48:15really critical. And I'll say lastly, but certainly not least on our panel this morning is Dr. Susan
48:21Fox, who is founder of the Park Slope Parents. Susan, you're a parent and you also work closely
48:27with other families in your community. Why do you think it's so important for parents and families
48:31to stay connected to discuss the youth mental health crisis and social media's role in it?
48:38Thank you for your attention to this important issue. The other folks on this panel have discussed
48:43so many of the important issues. I'm going to focus on the community side. You know, as someone
48:50who leads a community of over 7,000 families, I've seen the power that parents have if we join
48:55together. And we absolutely need to discuss the youth mental health crisis and social media's
49:00role in it. But we have to be mindful about how to protect our youth and reverse this tide of
49:08smartphone use because the ball's already rolling. Legislation is a great step toward making this
49:14happen. You know, more importantly, though, I think we need to band together to normalize
49:19not having phones and limiting access to social media so young. Passing legislation, like I said,
49:28will help. And as Governor Hochul said, you know, we can help save kids from themselves.
49:35We have to set norms within our kids' friends groups, as well as the larger community,
49:41such as delaying when we let kids get smartphones and social media. We know that
49:48middle schoolers' sense of themselves is in flux and influenced by what other people,
49:54especially their peers, think and say. And these formative years are so important.
50:02So, if we decide as one parent in a sea of parents who allow smartphones to not give our child a
50:10smartphone, that's not the way to go. You know, parents banding together will prevent
50:15also this idea of othering, othering kids who don't have social media. No one wants to feel
50:22out, left out, and not having social media or missing the latest TikTok friends during this
50:28awkward time can lead to FOMO, as Erin said. You know, my own two kids, who are 20 and 22 now,
50:36they didn't get social media until later, until after eighth grade. And I was talking to my
50:43daughter, and she said, I felt like I was missing out on things. I felt like, you know, as we all
50:48did, we weren't allowed to watch SpongeBob SquarePants, or we didn't know who shot JR.
50:55So, when we talk to parents, so when you talk to the parents of your kids' friends and jointly
51:02decide to limit their social media use, that fear of missing out doesn't happen as much,
51:09because everybody's on the same playing field, as Bernice said earlier. If all your friends are
51:17doing it and you're not, you feel the need to catch up. We also need to band together to let
51:23schools know that we as parents are okay not having our kids have their phones during the
51:32school day. And, you know, Governor Hochul, I applaud, applaud, applaud this. You know,
51:38when you think about it, we absolutely don't need to be in touch with our kids every single moment
51:44of the day. And parents need to know, and this is a little nod to the Let Grow Project, parents need
51:51to know that their kids are safer out in society right now than any other time in history. And
51:57giving their kids the freedom out in the world is this wonderful thing. So, if we're not going to,
52:05if we're going to limit smartphones and social media, we have to replace it with something else.
52:10And that something else needs to be less structured, more independent, and free play.
52:17These smartphones are passive instruments. They entertain us. They entertain us. We need
52:24to bring back old-fashioned opportunities to play outside, run errands, walk to school.
52:29We need kids, what kids need is an appreciation for their capacity to change and cope with whatever
52:36life throws at them. And big tech is hurting their ability to do that. Other parents,
52:44other parents need to band together to support the decision to let their kids play outside,
52:50to not have phones, and not shame or criminalize parents, giving kids real-world independence.
52:58And I'll end with this quote that John Haidt says from Let Grow. He says,
53:04if parents don't replace screen time with real-world experiences involving friend
53:10and independent activity, banning phones, limiting phones, limiting social media will
53:16feel like deprivation, not opening up a world of experience. Thanks, Governor Hochul,
53:21for saying this is such an important issue to address.
53:25And Dr. Fox, I think that was a fantastic way to close this wonderful panel.
53:30There was lots of cheers for some of your comments. I don't know if you saw. And to all
53:34of our panelists, thank you so much for your time and really expertise and work in this area. I know
53:40the Governor and all of the legislature and many of the parent advocates are going to be calling
53:44on you over the next few days and few months to try to get this work done to continue to support
53:49our students. I'm going to toss things back to you, Governor, to close and continue to thank
53:53you for the work that you're doing to support kids, raise awareness, and make every child's
53:56potential a reality. Governor? Well, thank you, Kyle. You did a great job of getting out of each
54:02person their perspectives and their sometimes life experience that helped continue this debate
54:09and allow me as the Governor to process what I've heard today, layer that on top of the
54:15information I already had, and just march on forward. And we don't want any more young people
54:21to be suffering and struggling and parents so uncertain about how to pull their child back from
54:27the abyss. There's nothing more paralyzing for a parent than to say, I don't know how to help my
54:32child. And we have to stop that. It didn't happen when my kids were much younger. That was my space
54:39and it wasn't these addictive algorithms. And now they're, you know, adults themselves. And
54:44I'm glad I got through that. But I've got a grandchild who's going to be coming up through
54:49that. So we don't have to have every parent in fear of this, this world, which was not there
54:56when they were growing up. And I do so miss seeing young people get out there and just
55:01making up their own activities and playing and kicking a ball in the backyard or tossing balls,
55:07you know, just going to the movies, go hang out them all together in person with somebody. I mean,
55:12what happened to that? So we can get back to that because we're the first generation of
55:19parents to see the effects of social media in a profound way. We're the first ones who are
55:25calling it out. We're the first ones who are saying, we will do something about it. So I want
55:31everybody to be even more motivated in touching your networks to bring to bear the support we
55:37need. We have a lot of support here at Albany, but we just have to get through the next few days,
55:41work it out, and then let the process play out and then go on for the next challenge.
55:46And I'm fascinated to hear the word FOMO because that's something I learned from my teenagers at
55:51the time. Like FOMO sounds dreadful. What is it? It's like you're missing out. And I, and I
55:57listening to these young people in all these forums over the last year, they desperately don't
56:02want to be ostracized and be the person who didn't know something or, or something. One young woman
56:08said, they're saying bad things about me today. I need to know about it so I can walk past that
56:13person in the hallway. I mean, I'm being, it was sad to know that the world revolved around what
56:18was happening on their smartphones and not what was happening in the school environment around
56:24them or outside of school. So, so we're motivated. We're ready to march on. And I, I want to rely on
56:30this particular group as an advisory capacity, as we talk about the whole concept of smartphones in
56:37schools. I want to talk about this. I want to hear what's on your minds, the upsides, the downsides,
56:42and how we can, you know, process that going into the next session as well. So, so thank you. Every
56:48generation has its challenges, but I see leaders and, and caring individuals and particularly the
56:54parents want to do something and meet the moment of today. So thank you everyone.