Street Debate: Are our gender roles outdated?
Should the kitchen be a woman's place? Who should attend to the kids? The 77 Percent asked young Liberians to unpack gender roles and talk about how new dynamics could affect the power balance in relationships.
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00:00 Hello and welcome back to the 77% Strict Debate. This week we are in Liberia's capital of Monrovia.
00:06 Now you might be familiar with the expression "strong African woman".
00:10 In this country they certainly are, having had a female president in Ellen Sirleaf Johnson.
00:15 But this strength in women is sometimes discouraged when it comes to romantic relationships,
00:20 particularly in the African context. And today we want to find out why.
00:23 Who better to answer this question for me than some Liberians.
00:26 And we're going to start with the couple on the panel. We have a couple, they're so loved up.
00:32 Austin and Chantal, thanks for joining us.
00:34 So let's start with the basic question of your day to day.
00:37 When you wake up in the morning, give me a little clue about who does what in the morning.
00:41 What's your morning routine like? Chantal, you're really smiling, let me start with you.
00:46 Well, thank you. In the morning I wake up around 5, 5 like 5.30 and get my kid ready for school.
00:55 While he's there getting ready for work.
00:58 Okay, so would you say that your domestic responsibilities are sort of equally split between the two of you?
01:03 Yeah, it is.
01:05 Basically, I'm able to wake up early morning and get hot water for the kids.
01:10 I'm able to be bathing the little girl while she is preparing cocoa oats or something.
01:15 So yeah, I think it's good and I enjoy doing it.
01:18 Abraham, where are you?
01:20 I know that you have a biblical name and also an old fashioned stance on the concept of equality in relationships.
01:27 Tell me a little bit about that.
01:28 For me, I come with an African cultural background and there are rules ascribed to men, both men and women.
01:36 I believe that most of the host choices in our African context are the responsibility of the woman, but the man can be of help.
01:47 Let me tell you, I'm laughing because the women behind me are really sighing.
01:51 You started something and I would like you to complete it, please.
01:55 So you started by telling me women's responsibilities in a relationship, a heteronormative one, do all the house chores.
02:02 No, I said most of the host choice is the woman's responsibility.
02:10 So what does the man do then?
02:12 In our Liberian setting, he is the head of the home.
02:15 He's responsible to provide for the home.
02:19 OK, tell me what you're thinking, Nowu.
02:22 Nowu is a feminist and an activist.
02:26 Yes, knowing that Liberia was set on the basis of patriarchy just explains why they're saying these different things.
02:35 But when you look at who set those rules, who gave the responsibilities of a woman taking charge of the home and doing the choices,
02:45 you will know that the men set those rules and which we believe were very biased, right?
02:50 Because women's potential is way beyond just taking care of home.
02:55 I want to hear from some people at the back, right?
02:58 Let me get some reactions. Come closer to me, please.
03:00 I'm a traditionalist.
03:02 Now I stand against the issue of women having equal rights with men in the home.
03:08 And women must be submissive.
03:10 It never used to happen like that.
03:11 The only reason why we have a feminist, we have a woman activist, is because they have acquired education.
03:17 OK, so quick question.
03:19 I'm a woman here who's doing this job of asking questions and moderating.
03:23 I would say I'm independent.
03:24 Does that bother you?
03:26 Yeah. A woman in our African culture must not be independent.
03:30 What if I told you that in my culture, women are actually the heads of the home?
03:35 That's a culture.
03:36 In our culture, in our setting here, in neighbour country, the women are very submissive.
03:41 OK, so let me come back to the couple.
03:43 Oh, they're even holding hands.
03:44 Let me tell you, we are feeling so single today on this set.
03:51 So when you hear some of these assertions, I can imagine that there must also be people in your family who also have hold similar views.
03:59 The community says the ladies should wake up and wash the dishes.
04:04 You, the man, you wake up, just get ready for work and move on, you know, and then you start to follow that.
04:10 I don't get it. Why should you do that?
04:12 So I woke up early morning and what is going to shock people is that the man, you as a man, you benefit a lot if there's equality in the home.
04:23 Your mother comes to visit you and then she sees you washing the dirty clothes.
04:27 She's like, why is my son washing dirty clothes?
04:30 Let me hear from Magdalene for a second, because we haven't spoken to her.
04:32 I just want to investigate this idea of the head of a home, because because no one has talked about partnerships in a contemporary world that we live in today.
04:42 Do we still need that classical head of a home?
04:46 Well, I have no interest in relationship anymore.
04:48 It is because of what I went through when I was in relationship.
04:53 So I had to quit 2019 because I had an abusive partner, overly protective, and he was very abusive.
05:03 So I went through it.
05:05 I held my gun like, King, I have to wake up in the morning and put socks, put boxer and money all behind him.
05:15 Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
05:17 I need to understand this.
05:18 What do you mean?
05:19 Put socks, put what?
05:20 Help him dress up in the morning.
05:23 Like a child.
05:24 Of course.
05:25 But I went extra mile in, you know, helping to keep my relationship.
05:31 And I have a question for you.
05:33 As you were treating him as a king, as you're saying, which by the way, absolutely.
05:37 Was he treating you as a queen?
05:40 Well, he was abusive.
05:43 He was really abusive.
05:46 So it has actually made me to lost interest in having relationship.
05:52 And when I see people like, you know, couples and I feel like they're not being true to each other.
06:00 Okay.
06:01 So obviously not all relationships which have that dynamic will end up in abuse.
06:06 Yeah.
06:07 Let's just be clear about that.
06:08 However, it can because there's a power dynamic there that has not been addressed.
06:14 So how do you how do you navigate that?
06:17 So for me, people always put or have a negative connotation when it comes to head of home.
06:27 We're not saying that the woman should be the one to dress you.
06:31 It's not it's not a woman's responsibility to dress you.
06:35 If that is happening, that's abuse.
06:39 Knowing your rules is different from being abused.
06:41 But I'm saying that there are ascribed rules for men and women in a home.
06:47 And I hold that very clearly.
06:49 Okay.
06:50 I mean, that's your position and that's perfectly fine.
06:53 We've had many things, right, including the traditionalist who thinks that women shouldn't even be educated.
06:59 Let me hear from. Oh, I am so afraid to bring the microphone to you.
07:02 But let's hear you. Let's hear your point.
07:04 It's a need that we go back to our tradition.
07:06 Our women were submissive.
07:08 But the Western culture now have changed everything.
07:10 And that is why we are having a debate.
07:12 And that is why you have a feminist.
07:13 And that is why you are educating our women.
07:15 You are spoiling them in the home.
07:18 Okay.
07:19 So let me just.
07:21 Are you working, for example, and you must have female bosses.
07:24 How do you respond to that?
07:27 Having a boss, you know, female is kind of complicated because I really don't see her being submissive.
07:35 Sometimes she just she just responds to men.
07:39 And that is not how it's supposed to be.
07:41 So women being a boss, they can be very abusive to men.
07:45 Oh, OK. I honestly cannot believe that I am hearing these words in 2023.
07:50 But but but but I mean, your your your viewpoint.
07:55 Let me get one last one here.
07:57 When women are in power, when women are educated, when women are learned, the society becomes better.
08:02 Because, come on, we carry children in our wombs for nine months, which is huge.
08:06 So we understand relationship because we bond with them for nine months.
08:10 When they come outside, they will bond with them.
08:12 Even their husband in the womb, we sometimes take care of them as babies.
08:16 They are outside as bosses.
08:18 But when they come home, they are babies.
08:19 Men should support women.
08:21 Then we can be able to make their home and society better.
08:24 All right. Normally, at this point of the debate, I would be asking people for solutions.
08:29 But after hearing all the diverse opinions, I'm not sure that there is such a thing as solutions.
08:34 We started with a couple. I'd like to end with them.
08:36 We've had so many viewpoints here.
08:39 Do you think that the kind of relationship that the two of you have, which some people might see as aspirational, is under threat?
08:46 When you woke up in the morning as a man getting ready for work, when you stand before that mirror, just see a human being.
08:53 When you see your wife, see a human being, treat her that way.
08:57 Men, you are going to be happy if you bring the woman to that equal point.
09:02 You are going to be happy because we are just equal.
09:05 We have disagreements on ideas.
09:08 Who should win or who is the head?
09:11 It depends on the idea that we are pushing.
09:13 Whoever pushes the better idea, we go by that.
09:15 All right.
09:16 I think it's going to be good for all of us.
09:17 Thank you. That is a beautiful place to wrap this debate.
09:20 We have heard some very controversial remarks today.
09:23 But also, what a nice way to wrap it up.
09:25 Think first and foremost of your partner as human.
09:29 Thank you guys for watching.