Billie Eilish ('Barbie'), Cynthia Erivo ('Drift'), Dua Lipa ('Barbie'), Jon Batiste ('American Symphony'), Julia Michaels ('Wish') and Olivia Rodrigo ('The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes') talk to THR about their songwriting inspiration, their very first music purchase and why Billie Eilish thought she had already "peaked" in Off Script With The Hollywood Reporter hosted by Yvonne Orji.
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00:00 I find songwriting very difficult and I find honesty in songwriting very hard and out of my reach.
00:07 And there's something so special to me about writing about not my life.
00:14 I played it for a friend and we were sitting in the car and I was like...
00:18 I was like, "Whoa!"
00:22 Who did it to them?
00:25 Who did it to them?
00:27 Welcome to Off Script with a Hollywood Reporter. I'm Yvonne Orji and we are here at The Georgian,
00:32 a historic hotel in Santa Monica, California.
00:35 Hey, question for you. Have you ever just gotten a song stuck in your head?
00:40 I mean, this song just makes you want to do a bop, makes you want to groove, it makes you feel so happy.
00:45 You know? Or maybe it's a song that just really hits you and then you're there on the airplane in seat 32B,
00:51 it's an aisle, and you just start thinking about your ex and you're like, "Oh my God, maybe I should call her."
00:56 Girl, you know you should definitely not call him.
00:59 You get what I mean, right?
01:01 Alright, well today you are going to meet six amazingly talented songwriters whose music and lyrics
01:06 have made us feel all of the feels this year while watching some of our favorite movies.
01:11 So sit back, relax, and get your groove on with John Batiste, American Symphony,
01:16 Billie Eilish, Barbie, Cynthia Erivo, Drift, Dua Lipa, Barbie,
01:23 Julia Michaels, Wish, and Olivia Rodrigo, The Hunger Games, The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes.
01:30 They are on the record, but maybe just a bit off script with The Hollywood Reporter.
01:37 Take it away, Mets Fin.
01:40 Thanks, Yvonne. I'm Mets Fin Fakadu, and this is Off Script with The Hollywood Reporter Songwriters Roundtable.
01:46 How are you guys doing?
01:47 Good.
01:48 Good.
01:49 I'm so excited that you all could be here. Such a talented group of people.
01:53 I know some of you know each other. Some are probably just meeting today.
01:56 Maybe.
01:57 Perfect.
01:58 Well, I wanted to ask, as songwriters, do you remember the first song or lyric you wrote?
02:06 I don't know how old you were, but I want to hear some of that backstory.
02:09 How about you, Cynthia?
02:10 Yeah, I was 16 and I wrote a song called "Maybe."
02:13 I think it was given to a South African girl group or something.
02:18 I guess the first song I wrote on piano proper, I was probably 14 or 15 and I wrote this feminist anthem called "Superman," about how I didn't need Superman to come and save me.
02:32 That's right.
02:33 Start 'em young.
02:35 On the right track.
02:38 Gosh, when I think about mine, it was completely different.
02:42 I was always making up songs when I was really little.
02:45 When I was about four or five years old, I made up this song.
02:48 Albanian was my first language, so I sang it in Albanian.
02:52 It was a song that I'd made for my mum.
02:54 I'd walk around the house and I'd be like, "When I grow up, can I borrow your shoes?"
02:57 "When I grow up, can I wear your dress?"
02:59 "When I grow up, can I be just like you?"
03:01 It actually just stuck around. It's one thing that at home we just always remind ourselves of.
03:08 I love that.
03:10 How about you, John?
03:12 Oh, well.
03:14 I was doing a lot of music instrumentally for many years.
03:19 I started writing lyrics for a Shakespeare play that wanted songs in the play.
03:28 I was probably about 21, and I started writing it.
03:33 I was like, "Man, characters and worlds and the expression of all these interconnected relationships
03:43 and how I can make all these sounds come together."
03:46 That was the end of it.
03:48 [laughter]
03:50 I love that stuff.
03:52 [laughter]
03:55 I'm trying to think. I think that what comes to mind is probably when I was eight or something.
04:03 It was like, "I'm going down, down, down into the black hole, sweeping up your soul."
04:13 I was like, "Fiddy."
04:15 [laughter]
04:17 I was like, "It's tight."
04:19 Were you going through something at the time as an eight-year-old?
04:21 No. Listen, I was writing stories, man.
04:24 [laughter]
04:25 I feel like the first song that I wrote was probably when I was 11-ish.
04:31 No, now that I think about it, I was six, and it was me and my friend.
04:36 We were playing the ukulele, and it was a song about ukuleles.
04:39 I don't know. Whatever.
04:41 You guys have good stories.
04:43 I don't really have a good story.
04:45 I started writing when I was six as well.
04:48 Just bad little things.
04:50 Yeah, really, really bad.
04:53 The first thing I ever got was this theme song for a Disney Channel show when I was 17,
04:59 the show called Austin & Ally.
05:01 [cheers]
05:04 That was my first whatever.
05:08 The rest was history.
05:10 [laughter]
05:13 I wanted to ask, too, what's the first album you remember buying or downloading?
05:19 For some of us, for me it was cassettes and CDs, and I'm older.
05:23 For some of you, I imagine it's iTunes or Spotify.
05:26 But do you remember what was that first album that you bought?
05:30 Never Say Never, Brandy.
05:32 I was obsessed with it, and I would play it.
05:36 I remember I wrote her a letter.
05:39 I was like 12 or something.
05:41 I wrote her a letter because I just was obsessed with her voice.
05:44 I'd never heard anyone like that.
05:46 Everything about the sounds that she was making connected with me really, really deeply.
05:52 I think I bought more than one of those.
05:56 Was this cassette or CD?
05:57 It was CD.
05:59 It's crazy now, so many years later, Burner Boys, just samples sitting on top of the world.
06:04 Sitting on top of the world.
06:05 Full circle.
06:06 Yeah.
06:07 I don't think I'm not playing that over and over again.
06:09 It's like a nice little throwback to something that was a really sweet memory for me.
06:13 Do you remember what was in the letter?
06:15 I think I just wrote that she was my favorite singer.
06:18 I think I must have thanked her for writing the album or something.
06:22 I don't know.
06:23 I just really connected with it.
06:26 Something about the way she used harmony in her songs was new to me.
06:33 It felt like, "Oh, I like that.
06:36 I like what she's doing with her voice.
06:38 I want to learn to do that with my voice."
06:41 Yeah.
06:42 It was really special.
06:44 How about you, Elena?
06:46 I remember getting my first phone.
06:48 I was probably 12 or 13, and the first thing I did was download Lorde Pure Heroine.
06:53 I love that record so much.
06:55 I remember listening to it as I first started writing songs and just being blown away by her lyrics
07:03 that are just about being a teenager living in the suburbs.
07:07 I just remember never hearing my life be put into a song like that.
07:13 It just made being young and doing these seemingly unimportant things feel so sacred and beautiful.
07:19 That album is one of my favorites, and she still inspires me a lot to this day.
07:24 When Royals came out, the radio did not have that sound on it.
07:28 I think she definitely opened doors to not follow trends and set her own trends.
07:35 Completely, yeah.
07:36 I remember hearing that song on the radio for the first time.
07:38 It was one of those "pinch me" moments where you always remember a snapshot in memory.
07:42 "Oh my God, what is this?" It changes the trajectory of your life.
07:46 That's my first one.
07:48 Now while you guys were speaking, I was thinking it was either between Alicia Keys' songs in A minor,
07:53 which I just absolutely love that record, but it also "Woe, Nelly" by Nelly Furtado.
07:59 It was also a really big one for me.
08:02 I wouldn't be able to know which one came first, but it was something about Alicia's voice,
08:10 the pain, the love, the feeling, and everything that she carried with it felt really meaningful.
08:18 I felt like I was going through a breakup having never had a boyfriend.
08:21 [laughter]
08:23 And then Nelly Furtado as well. I loved how she mixed her Spanish roots with all the music that she made.
08:30 I felt really, I loved that.
08:32 There's something really cool about the combination of those two singers,
08:35 because they both have that ability to express pain in their voices.
08:41 Where Nelly Furtado's voice sits is like...
08:44 They have it raw.
08:46 I love that you found that in both of them.
08:49 It's really cool.
08:51 They both came out the same year. I remember that year they were both nominated for Best New Artist at the Grammys,
08:56 and also NDIR. So it was like these three super unique, different voices.
09:01 They're such strong female artists. I think they really had their own identity,
09:05 and they knew exactly what they were talking about, and they were just so open with their experiences.
09:10 That's why I think people connected so much.
09:13 And all around, like, 21 years of age. So it's amazing.
09:16 John, what about you? Do you remember the first CD or cassette you bought?
09:21 I bought CDs at Blockbuster Video from the UCD band.
09:28 I was playing gigs from a young age, so I had some money.
09:32 I remember I first bought four records.
09:34 I can't remember what the fourth record was, but it was a cracked copy of Michael Jackson's "Dangerous,"
09:41 and Erykah Badu's "Mama's Gun."
09:44 Yes! I love that.
09:47 Oh my gosh, that record.
09:49 It's like what you reminded me of with Nelly, and even just the sound of her voice, for sure,
09:57 but the artistic purpose. Every great artist is like, "Oh, y'all have such clear, just acutely aware,
10:05 profound artistic purposes." Every great artist has a great artistic purpose.
10:10 I'm still trying to figure mine out, but I remember when I heard those records,
10:14 that's what I heard in every one of them. Oh yeah, Bjork, Vespertine.
10:19 That was the fourth one. And Voodoo, D'Angelo.
10:23 Those four records, I remember that, and I was like, "Man, it's super, super convicted."
10:29 Everything about it is very much coming from the most pure channel,
10:35 that space up there that we all try to dip into. I like that a lot.
10:40 That album is crazy.
10:44 So when I was checking the liner notes, "Oh, liner notes. Oh, I remember liner notes."
10:50 So you read the thing, oh my gosh, D'Angelo wrote this incredible mission statement in there.
10:57 And then I looked at it, I was like, "Oh wow, there's a lot of similarities.
11:01 'Mama's Gun' and Voodoo were recording in the year 2000 in Electric Lady Studios,
11:06 so there's a lot of crossover in terms of the personnel."
11:09 And then I was like, "That's why I gotta get to New York. I gotta get to New York City."
11:14 But yeah, that record, Spanish Joints.
11:17 You recorded some of your album there?
11:19 Yeah, I made lots of my new album at Electric Lady. It's my favorite place ever.
11:23 Such good history.
11:25 And was it your first time recording there?
11:27 Yeah, it was so much fun. I used to roll my eyes at people when they were like,
11:31 "I love to go to New York, it's so inspiring."
11:33 I'm like, "Sure, whatever, how inspiring can it be?"
11:36 But getting there, yeah, the vibes are just incredible.
11:39 It's very hallowed halls, that studio, you know?
11:41 So much to pull from.
11:43 Oh my goodness, you in the right place.
11:45 Oh, it's the best. The best.
11:50 How about you, Billie?
11:51 Well, I had a little blue MP3 player that was like this big.
11:57 And I remember I had--
11:59 Hit clips?
12:00 Yeah, girl.
12:02 I had "I Kissed a Girl" in there.
12:04 Let's go.
12:06 And I was like, "Hmm."
12:09 Noting. Noting how I feel about this.
12:13 But I also-- the first song I remember trying to go buy and then download
12:20 was "Sail" by AWOLNATION.
12:23 But I didn't know who it was by, I didn't know what song it even was.
12:26 And I looked up on iTunes, like, "Sail," and I just bought the first one that I saw.
12:31 And it was like not the song.
12:33 And so I had only one song for a long time, and it was "Sail" by some guy.
12:37 Some other song, I couldn't tell you what it was.
12:39 But Phineas, my brother, was really mad that I did that.
12:43 "Sail" is sick. That song is tight.
12:46 But I think the albums that I first remember downloading and listening to front to back
12:53 were "Green Day," I think.
12:56 "American Idiot?"
12:57 "American Idiot" was a big one for me and my family.
13:01 It's funny what you mentioned about "Sail."
13:03 That was such a sleeper hit.
13:05 I love when a song is released and two years later it climbs.
13:09 And it's also been licensed, literally, TV shows, car commercials.
13:14 The amount of money he's made from that song is pretty magical.
13:19 And also I love the idea of not thinking of that when creating the song
13:23 and it just having its own life.
13:26 That song, I don't care what anyone says, that song blew my mind.
13:32 That song was the coolest shit I'd ever heard in my life.
13:35 It really inspired me in terms of different sounding stuff.
13:43 I also liked "The Walking Dead," and there's a character called--
13:47 Who's this guy? Do you guys watch that show?
13:49 You know when in the first season the guy that gets locked on the roof?
13:53 Oh, yeah, yeah.
13:56 I always pictured him screaming "Sail."
14:01 I thought he was singing "Sail" in the song.
14:03 I was picturing him screaming.
14:05 D.
14:07 Yeah, kids, dude.
14:09 Imagination's just good.
14:12 That's also the other cool thing is AWOLNATION has one of the biggest hits,
14:17 but I'm forgetting the lead singer's name.
14:19 He can walk outside and just have an interview.
14:23 He's good.
14:24 That's like the perfect life almost.
14:26 Yeah, great idea.
14:28 Mailbox money.
14:31 Oh, yeah.
14:33 Yellow.
14:35 Julia?
14:37 I mean, the first album I ever was given for Christmas was "Train."
14:44 Whoa.
14:45 I know, yeah, with "Meet Virginia" on it.
14:48 I just loved that song when I was a kid.
14:51 And then obviously as I got older and angsty, "Jagged Little Pill" was my holy grail.
14:59 I just loved her lyricism and just how unapologetic she was.
15:05 And she was also hot AF.
15:09 Yes, yes, yes.
15:11 Did you see her in "Dogma"?
15:13 I didn't, no.
15:14 There's a film called "Dogma"--this is me being a geek.
15:16 There's a film called "Dogma" and she is spectacular.
15:19 She doesn't say a word.
15:20 Doesn't say anything.
15:21 Doesn't say anything.
15:22 I think also when you were 13, I was homeschooled.
15:26 A couple of homeschooled here, right?
15:28 Yeah.
15:29 "Hey, can I interview you in homeschool?"
15:32 So I think when you're kind of isolated and you're kind of angsty, she was the one.
15:40 She was my precedent.
15:42 You obviously all have amazing film songs that have been out this year.
15:46 And writing them and putting them together, I want to definitely talk to you all about them.
15:50 You, the 100th anniversary of Disney, did a lot of music for them.
15:55 What was that like?
15:56 And also, did you do background vocals on "Let It Go" from "Frozen"?
16:00 I did, yeah.
16:01 Wow.
16:02 Hey, hold on.
16:03 Very cool.
16:04 I thought I read that somewhere and I was like, "Wait, what?"
16:07 I did, yeah.
16:08 Okay, first tell us about that because you were already in the Disney family.
16:11 Yes.
16:12 Basically, I was 19 at the time and I was doing demos around the city to meet people and pay my rent.
16:22 And I got a call from someone that was working on the Demi version of the song.
16:29 And they were like, "Hey, we need some backgrounds done for this song. It's for a Disney film."
16:34 I was like, "Yeah, sure. No problem."
16:36 And funny enough, 10 years later, cut to, the song that I did backgrounds for,
16:43 the movie was directed by the same people that directed the film that I wrote all the songs for.
16:49 So it's just like a very beautiful, serendipitous thing that happened unexpectedly.
16:55 What was that like when you get in the call from Disney?
16:57 Because how many songs did you write for this film?
16:59 I did seven, I believe.
17:03 Wow.
17:04 We know Disney songs are huge.
17:06 No pressure.
17:08 And this wish, tell us about the inspiration and putting that together.
17:13 I was told that the protagonist in this film was sort of a young activist.
17:21 Basically, there was a lot of corruption in her town.
17:24 And she basically wanted to fight for things that she found immoral or just sort of unjust.
17:31 And I was like, "I can do that. I kind of know what that is."
17:36 And yeah, that was this wish.
17:39 It's really beautiful.
17:41 It was the first song I wrote for the film.
17:43 And it just sort of stood the test of time throughout the three-year process of making the movie.
17:49 And after writing that, did that kind of open the floodgates for you to be able to finish the other songs?
17:56 Yeah, it was very interesting.
17:57 I've never done songs for a film before.
18:01 I've only ever really written songs with artists or for myself.
18:05 So this was very new.
18:07 And the process was new.
18:09 Because I'd be like, "Oh, I'm done."
18:11 And then they'd call me two days later and be like, "Oh, we have a new song and we need it done in like three weeks."
18:15 I'm like, "Okay."
18:18 But overall, it was a really beautiful process.
18:22 I love it.
18:23 And so cool.
18:24 So, with Sofia's new film, Drift, she not only stars in it, she's produced it and written music for it.
18:31 Wow.
18:32 So, a hand clap there.
18:35 So, I wonder, in addition to the inspiration behind the song, what was it also like wearing so many hats?
18:41 Crazy.
18:42 Because, I mean, as a producer, I'm sure you were so hands-on with this.
18:45 Yeah, it was nuts.
18:46 Because it was a little--I always call it the little engine that cookers.
18:49 It was made for nothing, basically, a little indie movie that we made on location in Greece.
18:54 And we didn't have much time to do it.
18:57 And so, I'm on set, but thinking about the schedule and making sure that we can get shots done when we need to get shots done.
19:04 But also being able to, like, "Hey, we need to finish off this scene. Are we going to have enough time for that?"
19:08 But trying to be in scenes that are really tough, really hard.
19:13 But the song, I think, was the easiest part for me, to be honest, because it sort of was inspired when I was on a run one morning.
19:23 And I listened to this song by an artist called Laura Mvula called "Father."
19:29 And for some reason, it connected with where I was at that time, what I was feeling, what I was experiencing, and what this movie was about.
19:39 So I knew automatically that I wanted to work with Laura because I thought she understood the language of where I was and what I was doing.
19:48 So I texted her. I didn't tell anyone else first that this is what I wanted to do, which is not what you're supposed to do.
19:54 I texted her and I was like, "Would you be into working with me on a song for this?"
20:00 She said yes. Then I told them, "This is who I want to write this with, and that's what's going to happen."
20:06 I don't think I really gave them a choice.
20:09 And then we sat in a studio after she'd watched the movie, and she sent me this message.
20:15 She was like, "It feels like there's water and movement and transition."
20:20 She was really moved by it, and so I felt like she understood.
20:23 And we sat, we wrote this song, and it didn't take us very long to write it.
20:26 I think we wrote it in a couple days, and then she did lots of production on it.
20:31 And the first thing, there's these two chords that she plays, I think, on the organ.
20:37 It just goes, "Dum, dum, dum, dum, dum."
20:41 And I was like, "Oh, I'm there."
20:44 So as we started playing with our vocals and trying to figure out what it wanted to be, it just sort of made itself, really.
20:51 I'm really proud of it, because it felt like it was the language of the piece that we had made.
20:58 - That's beautiful. - Thank you.
21:01 I know you, Olivia. Hunger Games, everyone is so excited for this to come out.
21:05 For you, what was the inspiration in creating this song?
21:08 It was so much fun.
21:10 Most of my songs are very diaristic in nature and kind of about my life,
21:15 and it was such a fun challenge to get to watch this movie through the eyes of this character
21:20 and then go and try to capture her experience through my words and my voice.
21:26 I find that there's so much inspiration in restricting yourself sometimes.
21:32 I don't know if you guys ever have this, but it's like when you have every color in the palette,
21:37 and any canvas you want, it's just so overwhelming that sometimes I think limiting yourself
21:42 actually makes you just think outside the box and reinvent.
21:46 And so I think that's one of the joys about writing a song for a movie,
21:52 is there's this beautiful storyline that you kind of get to color in with your own words.
21:58 So yeah, I had a lot of fun. It was a very welcome challenge, so I'm really happy to do it.
22:05 And John, you have a documentary that your song is from.
22:08 So let us know a little bit about the documentary and also writing music for this.
22:12 It started out as one thing, and then it changed, life came into the picture.
22:18 I started to write a symphony that was premiering at Carnegie Hall,
22:23 and I wanted to document the process of the last year of going and answering the question
22:31 of what would a symphony be if it was invented by someone like me in the 21st century.
22:39 Who would be on stage? What would they play? What would that experience be like?
22:45 I wrote this piece called "American Symphony," so that's the title of the documentary.
22:49 But we started to film, and about a month into filming,
22:53 there was a lot of changes in my life personally, as well as in my career.
22:58 There was a week of being notified of being nominated for 11 Grammys.
23:03 It was a week that--
23:05 Cash, super cash.
23:07 I mean, it was literally happening. People knew about that.
23:11 They didn't know--my wife, she got diagnosed with leukemia,
23:15 so we didn't know if she was going to make it.
23:17 I remember I got a call from President Biden, and we were in the chemotherapy ward,
23:22 and he was congratulating me about the nominations while we were getting news about what her treatment would be.
23:28 So then we decided to keep filming.
23:31 So it became the symphony of life.
23:33 You know how life has the duality of highs and lows, sometimes all at once,
23:39 and sometimes extreme highs and lows all at once.
23:42 So the music in the film is largely the symphony,
23:46 but there was a moment where Matt and I, the director, we talked about
23:52 what song would be appropriate as a final statement.
23:56 It's very moving to think about.
23:58 So she's doing great now.
24:00 I was going to ask, thank God.
24:02 Just to preface.
24:03 But when she was in the hospital, you know, it was about two months
24:07 where we didn't know if she was going to make it.
24:09 And in hospitals, all these sounds, you know, it's like beeps,
24:12 and all of these people coming in and out of the room,
24:15 and all the range of things that disturb your rest,
24:18 and I believe rest is important for the spirit to heal,
24:21 and all these things that I wanted to help her with, so I started writing her these lullabies.
24:26 She's a writer.
24:27 She would actually listen to your music and your music while she painted,
24:31 because she started painting just because her vision was blurred from the medication,
24:36 so she couldn't write anymore.
24:38 So our creative outlet was to paint while I would write these lullabies.
24:41 None of them were meant to come out, but the song came from one of these lullabies
24:46 that I wrote over that course of 30 or 40 days of being in and out of the hospital.
24:51 So that's what the song, the ethos of the song is from that period,
24:57 which I thought was a beautiful way to kind of tie a bow on this work
25:03 that we didn't know what we were making when we were doing it, and it was hard.
25:07 We had to reassess the decision every single month.
25:09 It's like 14 hours a day.
25:11 This filmmaker, Matthew Heineman, is known for being in war zones
25:15 and embedded in drug cartels, and he doesn't make films like this,
25:20 and it was such a part of our life.
25:23 We'd be in bed. He'd be there.
25:25 Literally one day I opened the door, and I'm in the shower, and I'm like,
25:28 "Why are you filming?"
25:29 And then he was like, "I'm only shooting from the waist up."
25:33 And I was like, "Do I really want to do this?"
25:36 But, you know, we did it, and I think it'll help some people,
25:41 and that's what I'm about, so it's there.
25:43 I hope it moves some people, and thank y'all for what y'all do
25:46 because I was very aware of the profundity of what we do
25:51 in her healing process with music and creativity.
25:54 Creativity has an act of survival, and I believe in that so strongly.
25:59 I believed in it before, but now I'm just like, "Let's go.
26:04 Let's make more beautiful things."
26:07 I love that.
26:08 You know, as creators, what is it like when you do hear
26:11 that your music has really helped someone in a hard time,
26:16 really just helping them persevere when it's so hard to think positively?
26:23 It's hard to take in.
26:25 I find myself like--
26:26 Overwhelmed.
26:27 Yeah, I don't really know how to believe it
26:30 because I know what it's like to be in that position,
26:34 and it's so real, and to think that you're helping somebody
26:40 who's in that is really--it's hard to believe,
26:43 and it's really astounding and special,
26:46 and almost you feel like undeserving.
26:48 Like, I didn't deserve to help you through that,
26:51 but it's so special and powerful.
26:54 It's a great way of putting it.
26:56 I feel that way a lot.
26:57 People say some stuff, and I'm like, "Oh, my God."
27:00 You know?
27:01 Yeah, yeah.
27:02 To be a part of someone's experience.
27:04 It's so magical.
27:05 It's very surreal.
27:06 It makes you focus in on the thing that you're actually doing.
27:09 So there's lots of noise around the actual art of making something,
27:13 making music, making film, making TV, whatever it is,
27:16 and when a person has taken the time to listen, to be there,
27:21 meet you where you're at, meet you where you were
27:23 when you made the thing, and take that with them
27:26 in their daily life, and use it as a tool to help them
27:30 get through whatever they're getting through,
27:32 you're a part of their lives.
27:35 You've made something that sticks with them,
27:38 that they get to carry with them,
27:40 and that is possibly one of the most incredible honors
27:43 you can have.
27:44 Yeah, really.
27:45 So that anything else is just not important.
27:49 That is the important thing, making things that people can hang on to
27:54 when there's nothing else to hang on to.
27:56 I think to refocus whenever it feels like everything else
27:59 is out of focus on that, I think that's really special.
28:04 You're so poetic.
28:05 I know.
28:06 It's silly.
28:07 I'm hanging on to every word.
28:10 You could just talk.
28:11 Yes, yes.
28:14 That means a lot because for me, if I'm honest,
28:17 I don't know that you could have told me when I was 15, 16
28:21 that I would be there, that I would be here,
28:24 that I could make music and have people listen to it.
28:27 It was like a pie-in-the-sky dream.
28:29 I feel the same now.
28:31 I feel completely the same.
28:33 I thought it was as unrealistic as a cartoon on TV.
28:37 I would watch artists and I'd be like, "Oh my God,
28:40 "I can't imagine doing something like that."
28:42 Never, ever thinking that that was even a possibility.
28:45 Doing this, sitting here, making music, writing songs,
28:49 putting them out, connecting with people, going on tour,
28:52 connecting one-to-one with people in a room.
28:54 It's such a profound experience that it seems so far from reach,
28:59 but it's real, and it's so cool that it's real
29:01 because when you have younger fans or people looking up to you,
29:07 they can also just see that and be like, "Oh, that could actually be me too."
29:11 And it's real. It's real and it's possible.
29:14 It's so cool to...
29:17 Especially as a songwriter too.
29:19 Growing up with Shelly Pikin and Linda Perry and Lindy Roth,
29:24 all of the songwriters that wrote for all of your favourite pop artists,
29:29 you're like, "How do you do that? How do you even get there?"
29:32 And then to be able to know them, write with them, be here,
29:37 is such a beautiful thing too.
29:39 Do you guys think about that when you're writing songs?
29:42 I find it incredibly difficult to think about it
29:44 when I'm actually in the process of it.
29:46 I think it doesn't hit me, the impact of it,
29:48 until months later on tour or something.
29:51 I think about this a lot, John, in your Grammy speech a few years ago.
29:55 You said, "I show up every day, I make music every day
29:59 because it's a spiritual practice for me."
30:01 I think about that all the time and that's totally what it is.
30:04 If I don't write every day or create something,
30:06 I don't feel like myself, I don't feel fulfilled.
30:08 It doesn't matter if I put it out.
30:10 It's something that you need to do, just breathing or eating.
30:15 I feel more anxious when I don't write.
30:17 Completely. I feel so anxious.
30:19 It's like an exorcism that happens with...
30:21 Yeah, it's like an exorcism.
30:23 I feel like for me, I think just us creatives in general,
30:27 we have a lot of things that go on in our minds all the time
30:30 so writing is sort of like the deep exhale.
30:33 So just letting it out.
30:34 And then you have this tangible thing that you can take with you everywhere.
30:37 You're like, "Okay, it's not in my body, it's here now."
30:40 This is how I feel right now.
30:42 Are you all writing every day normally
30:44 or is it when you're like, "I'm going to go create a song"?
30:48 I try, it's so hard, but I try.
30:50 If I'm not writing, I'm writing something.
30:53 I'm not writing necessarily always songs.
30:56 I write songs almost every day.
30:59 I love it though. I just love it so much.
31:02 I know we have these Barbie songs
31:04 that have been just like taking over the entire world.
31:08 First of all, that whole album is fire.
31:11 So many amazing different songs on there.
31:14 I want to ask you to do a dance tonight.
31:17 Obviously it's killing it.
31:18 What was it like for you putting that song together?
31:21 I mean, from the very beginning, the most fun experience.
31:24 It was something that I hadn't done before.
31:26 It was a completely new experience.
31:29 Basically, the way it came to be was Mark Bronson,
31:33 who's a friend of mine, DM'd me on Instagram.
31:36 That's amazing.
31:37 Which is weird because also we're like friends, so we text,
31:40 but he chose that as a form of contact.
31:42 That's the medium.
31:43 That's the medium, yeah, exactly.
31:45 So he basically hit me up and he was like,
31:47 "I'm working on this film with Greta Gerwig,
31:49 "and it's for Barbie,
31:50 "and it's possibly the funniest script I've read,
31:52 "and I really want you to write the song
31:54 "and put it in the big dance scene in the film."
31:56 And I was like, "This is an absolute no-brainer,
31:59 "like 1,000% yes, like such a big fan of Greta's work."
32:02 And I love Mark, and it was just such an easy yes.
32:06 I was, however, on tour at the time,
32:09 so I was like, "OK, when does this song need to be due?
32:12 "How much time do we have, and when can we get in the studio?"
32:15 And basically I just flew to New York.
32:17 We went in the studio, and we just had so much time
32:20 talking to Greta, understanding the premise of the film.
32:23 And what I loved is what you were saying
32:25 about the dualities of life,
32:27 and I think that really comes across in the Barbie film.
32:30 Especially for the people who haven't seen it, maybe,
32:33 it's like the importance of going and understanding
32:36 the deeper meaning of the film.
32:38 It's so much about, you know, stereotypical Barbie
32:40 having an existential crisis and finding out
32:43 what it's like to be, or to experience,
32:45 essentially, like the human condition
32:47 and the way that we are as people
32:49 and the emotions that we feel
32:51 and constantly striving for perfection
32:53 but not quite reaching it or trying, you know,
32:55 always trying to, I don't know,
32:57 we're constantly looking or striving
32:59 for something deeper, in a way.
33:01 And I think when making Dance the Night,
33:03 and Greta saying how inspired by disco she was,
33:06 I just thought about disco and the community it brings
33:09 and, you know, the way it brings people together.
33:11 You know, a genre of music that was such a release
33:14 when things weren't going well in the world
33:16 or whatever was happening.
33:18 It was so freeing to be able to go and release
33:21 everything that was outside and just enjoy that.
33:24 And so Dance the Night was created specifically
33:27 for Barbie's best day ever,
33:29 which then results in her thinking about death.
33:32 So it's really about those dualities of life
33:36 and being able to merge the two together.
33:38 And that's what I love the most.
33:40 Like, I love dance crying.
33:42 That's really, like, that's my genre.
33:46 - Wow. - I love dance.
33:48 There's nothing that makes me feel more of a release.
33:51 And I think it's important to have some, like,
33:54 optimism through the, I don't know,
33:57 through the pain. There's so much happening.
33:59 So it's good to have music and dance to release and disco.
34:04 When I listened to it, I was like,
34:06 I was immediately thrown into the '70s.
34:09 And I love what you're saying about the background
34:11 that it was on, because that music,
34:14 disco was the place that all of the misfits went to.
34:20 It's where all the people that didn't feel like they belonged went to.
34:24 Studio 54 is where everyone went to to convene.
34:27 If you didn't feel like you were normal,
34:29 if you didn't feel like you fit in and you wanted to fit somewhere
34:32 and you wanted to connect with someone, that's where they went.
34:35 And they listened to that.
34:36 And so when I was listening to it, I was like,
34:38 that's what it feels like. It's got that energy in it.
34:41 It's really cool.
34:43 And I love a dance song with good lyrics.
34:46 I feel like sometimes because the melody or the beat can be so good,
34:50 sometimes you listen to the lyrics and you're like,
34:53 what, that don't even rhyme.
34:55 And so I love that with a good dance song with good lyrics,
34:59 the lyrics are almost hidden and you catch them later.
35:01 It's almost like re-watching a TV show or a film
35:04 and noticing something else.
35:06 But that's what I love about this song as well.
35:08 Oh my gosh, we took so much time to...
35:12 Initially we wrote the song and then we went back two weeks later
35:17 and we kind of watched the scene with the song in it
35:20 and I was like, wait a second, I need to do some changes,
35:23 I need to do some lyric changes.
35:25 And we basically tailored little moments to the moves
35:28 that were happening in the film
35:30 so you can marry the moments together.
35:34 So that was really fun.
35:35 It was like a really interesting jigsaw puzzle and something.
35:38 Yeah, it was really special.
35:40 But I have just... this whole process with the song
35:43 and even with the new record,
35:46 I never wanted to let go of a good idea.
35:48 Before it used to be like, if I didn't get the whole song that day,
35:52 then it probably wasn't worth fighting for.
35:54 I don't know.
35:55 But now I'm like, if there's one part that I love,
35:57 I'll just keep digging, keep digging.
35:59 I mean, Julia knows me.
36:01 I feel like I have dragged her into my madness.
36:05 But I love your process.
36:07 I actually love that about you
36:09 because there are so many artists that will give up on a song after one day
36:13 if it's not perfect.
36:15 You're the first one to be like, this part is exceptional,
36:18 I want to make sure this other part is exceptional.
36:21 And I'm like, yeah, it should be.
36:23 I need to keep digging.
36:24 Absolutely.
36:25 Dance and I did a lot of digging.
36:27 I love that.
36:29 You all killed that.
36:30 I was riveted to see--I walked into the studio with Mark
36:34 and I saw all of y'all's notes hanging on the wall.
36:37 Oh, my God.
36:38 He showed me the scene.
36:40 It was just like the amount of excavation that y'all did.
36:44 That was very impressive.
36:46 I really believe in that, too.
36:48 I love that you said that because sometimes you find something
36:51 that's so great and it's speaking,
36:55 but it just hasn't met the rest of its tribe yet.
36:58 Right.
36:59 So there's no reason to put it away for good.
37:02 That's right.
37:03 But the intricacy of that scene, he broke it down for me a little bit.
37:08 I hope you're all right with that.
37:09 Yeah, of course.
37:10 So I was like, wow.
37:12 The whole movie is--just the whole Barbie movie is a lot--it's very deep.
37:18 Yeah.
37:19 Existential.
37:20 That's--whoo!
37:22 It's very Whitman-esque.
37:23 It's got a whole bunch of stuff in it that's underneath the surface.
37:27 That's what I love about a dance song.
37:29 Right.
37:30 With a great lyric.
37:31 Your lyrics--you always have great melodies,
37:33 and you always make sure the lyrics reach the level of the melodies.
37:37 Thank you.
37:38 Because dance music--
37:39 Oh, my gosh.
37:40 People can get lazy.
37:41 It can be like--
37:42 You're lying on the beach.
37:43 I'm like, let me write that.
37:44 Yeah, yeah.
37:45 [laughter]
37:47 Y'all are skilled in that.
37:48 I love that.
37:50 Thank you very much.
37:51 I find myself throughout most of my days,
37:54 this song is just in my head a lot.
37:58 I don't know why.
37:59 Yeah, yeah.
38:00 It's catchy, girl.
38:01 It's catchy.
38:02 It's really good.
38:03 You feel that.
38:04 But your Barbie song, girl.
38:06 So what was--take over, John.
38:09 Do it.
38:10 Do it, please.
38:11 [laughter]
38:12 Go ahead.
38:13 I want to know, like, what--
38:15 What's happening?
38:16 What's--
38:17 [laughter]
38:19 I don't know.
38:20 Why that progression of notes?
38:24 [sings]
38:27 Dude.
38:28 I just--but it's just--
38:29 immediately, my heart goes--
38:32 immediately.
38:34 Thank you.
38:35 Where were you?
38:36 That's the first thing that I wrote, was that.
38:40 Like, exact melody.
38:43 It was--okay, so it was a rainy day in January,
38:48 and it was the day after we'd seen it,
38:50 and I was just like--it was dark for me in my life.
38:53 And my brother and I were working,
38:55 and we were trying to make stuff for this album,
38:57 like, my album we were working on,
38:59 and it was just like a day of nothing.
39:02 It was just, like, idea after idea after idea
39:05 of just, like, no ideas.
39:07 Like, nothing was happening.
39:09 It was, like, the least creative.
39:11 We came up with so many different things,
39:13 and it was an instance where we were like,
39:15 "Yeah, we're just scratching these.
39:17 Like, this isn't even worth our time."
39:19 And it must have been--I think we were doing that
39:21 for probably, like, six hours,
39:23 and it was about--I want to say, like, 8 p.m.,
39:27 and I was like, "All right, well, I'm out of here.
39:29 Like, this is--I'm gonna go home.
39:31 We're done for the day. We tried.
39:33 We're gonna, you know, call it quits."
39:35 And then he was like, "Just for shits and giggles,
39:39 what if we tried to write that song?"
39:42 And I was like--you think after the day
39:45 of, like, garbage we've just made,
39:47 we're gonna make a perfect song for something
39:50 that is so, like--that needs something really good?
39:53 I was like, "I don't even have that in me."
39:55 First of all, I didn't know I would have it in me at all.
39:58 When it was brought up to me, I was like,
40:00 "I mean, thank you for asking, but I don't know
40:02 if I can give you what you're gonna need.
40:04 Like, I want you to have something astounding,
40:07 and hopefully I can get close to that,
40:09 but I don't know."
40:11 And Phineas literally sat at the piano
40:13 and immediately started playing the...
40:16 [humming]
40:18 And we've been using a handheld mic in the room
40:21 that just plays, like, through the speakers
40:23 instead of, like, headphones and sitting at the--
40:26 I never, like, use a booth or anything, so I was--
40:28 - Just the old SM. - Yeah, dude.
40:30 - Yes, that's true. - I was sitting
40:33 on the little couch with the handheld,
40:36 and he was playing those chords,
40:39 and it was just like...
40:41 [humming]
40:46 And then...
40:49 You know, we were talking a lot about the, like,
40:52 falling elegance-- or the floating, like, elegance
40:55 of her and her ability to, you know,
40:59 be so smooth and beautiful and perfect all the time,
41:02 and then, you know, the juxtaposition of her
41:04 suddenly falling and, like, can't do everything perfectly.
41:07 And so immediately it was that I used to float.
41:10 Now I just fall down.
41:12 And we immediately wrote that, and then I used to know,
41:15 but I'm not sure now, and I immediately was like,
41:17 "What I was made for?"
41:19 And then we were both like, "What was I made for?"
41:21 Like, asking the question after that.
41:23 And then we had that-- we did that in probably, like, five minutes.
41:26 - It was-- - See? It was like the--
41:28 It was God. It was God. I don't know.
41:30 - It was like some other-- - Yeah.
41:32 It was just the most perfect example to me
41:35 of, like, true, true, true inspiration
41:39 and connection.
41:41 And it was living in me that whole day,
41:43 but it wasn't coming out of me.
41:45 And, yeah, as soon as we hit the "What was I made for?" line,
41:50 we were both like, "Oh, okay."
41:52 And it's weird 'cause we didn't--
41:54 You know, again, we didn't go into it
41:56 knowing at all what we were gonna make
41:58 or if we were gonna make anything.
42:01 And it was just so clear that we needed to.
42:05 - Mm-hmm. - Mm-hmm.
42:07 I think, Olivia, like, I love writing for, like, film.
42:12 It's, like, one of my favorite things to do.
42:14 Not even just film, but, like, for something.
42:16 - Right. - Because the assignment--
42:18 I really love an assignment.
42:20 I love a prompt.
42:22 And for me, you know, I'm listening to you especially
42:24 and everybody talking about songwriting,
42:26 and you're just so good at it, and you just do it,
42:28 and it's easy, and it's fast, okay?
42:30 - As long as you don't laugh. - And, like, for me,
42:33 I find songwriting very difficult,
42:36 and I find honesty in songwriting
42:39 very hard and out of my reach.
42:42 And there's something so special to me
42:45 about writing about not my life.
42:49 And so when we're writing it, you know,
42:52 I'm not thinking about my life.
42:54 I was like, "This isn't about me at all."
42:57 This is just totally about another girl,
43:00 another character.
43:02 It has nothing to do with my life.
43:04 I swear on my-- like, I swear to God,
43:07 I never thought about myself one time.
43:09 I was thinking about a character,
43:11 and my brother was thinking about a character.
43:13 And then we wrote basically the entire song that night
43:16 aside from the ending verse.
43:18 And then the next day or two later,
43:20 I played it for a friend, and we were sitting in the car,
43:23 and I was like...
43:25 [laughter]
43:27 I was like, "Whoa."
43:29 - "Who?" - Who is that?
43:31 - "Who is that?"
43:33 I was like, "This bitch is singing about me!"
43:36 And it was scary.
43:38 - Oh, my God. - It was like--I'm, like, shaky.
43:40 Like, it was--it was scary.
43:42 I felt like--it was like if you woke up
43:45 and, like, someone had taken a photo of you sleeping.
43:47 You're like, "How are you-- how'd you do that?"
43:50 And, um, I don't know. It was crazy.
43:53 And I felt also--I'm talking a lot--
43:56 but also I was--my brother and I both
44:00 were in a period of, like, complete--
44:03 I don't even think writer's block is necessarily real.
44:06 I just think sometimes we're not able to pull it out of us.
44:11 But it was that.
44:13 It was a period of time when I just had nothing.
44:16 I had nothing to say.
44:18 I didn't know how to say what I thought I could say.
44:20 And we really hadn't written anything in a minute,
44:22 and I felt really worried.
44:24 And I was like, "Damn."
44:26 I honestly was concerned that it was over for me.
44:29 - Oh. - Yeah, I gotta be honest with you.
44:31 I really was like--
44:33 'Cause where were you in the middle of this new album?
44:35 Like, had you been trying for a while?
44:37 We'd been trying, and it wasn't really doing
44:40 what it usually would do in me.
44:44 And I was honestly like, "Damn, like, maybe I hit my peak,
44:49 and I don't know how to write anymore.
44:51 Like, I don't know how to do this."
44:53 - Crazy. - And thank God for that.
44:56 That was a Joe Brain and Buddy sing.
44:58 - Yeah. - But it was also your brother
45:00 feeling this way too?
45:02 Yeah, no, it was very-- I mean, I thank God for Greta, man.
45:05 She saved me. Really, honestly.
45:08 Like, getting that request, it was like a FaceTime.
45:11 It was a FaceTime.
45:13 And it brought us both out of it,
45:16 and it put us in a just--
45:18 Like, immediately we were inspired
45:20 and wrote so much more after that.
45:23 And being that honest without meaning to
45:26 was a lot, and especially when it came out,
45:29 I was like, "Ay-ay-ay-ay-ay!"
45:32 It was like somebody reading your diary or something.
45:36 Did it unlock something in you where you're like,
45:38 "Oh, I actually can be extremely vulnerable."
45:42 - Well-- - And it be received.
45:44 Yes and no, but yes, because the way that it was received
45:49 was so shocking to me.
45:52 I guess I forget that everybody feels the same
45:55 in so many ways, and that everything we feel,
45:58 somebody knows, you know?
46:00 And, like, I don't be the same thing.
46:02 But it's the same emotion.
46:04 It's the same emotion, exactly.
46:06 And I was really moved by that,
46:08 and especially the way that it brought women together
46:11 was, like, something that I feel so just proud of,
46:17 and I feel so-- I don't know.
46:20 Like, when it came out, and it was such a girl thing,
46:24 I was like, "I don't know." It felt really cool.
46:27 Speaking of women, how amazing is this table?
46:30 - Right. - I'm sorry.
46:32 - Absolutely. - Yeah, yeah.
46:34 To be doing this at a time where there really is
46:36 so much camaraderie with women is so--
46:39 - Excuse me, John. - Oh, John.
46:41 - Love you, Bri. - Love it.
46:44 But, like, just being at a table with people
46:47 who are genuinely happy for each other is so exciting.
46:51 - It's very true. - It really is true.
46:55 Like, I love you all. I want you all to win.
46:58 It's so sick.
47:00 Sorry.
47:02 I mean, I felt that way when trying to book this
47:05 and get people, and as I was, like, seeing who had songs,
47:08 I was like, "Oh, my God, we could have this amazing
47:11 young female songwriter."
47:13 And for young women to see all this representation,
47:17 I think, is so key.
47:19 - Thank you. - We got it in John and me,
47:22 so it works. We have y'all's backs.
47:24 I saw that when I got the invitation.
47:26 I was like, "I want to come learn from all of you."
47:29 - Right. - This is the thing. That's it.
47:32 I love what you said about the diary
47:34 and about bringing women together,
47:36 especially you've been a voice for your generation
47:39 so profoundly, but I think that's--
47:42 people want to read your diary,
47:45 but they also want to read their diary.
47:47 - Yes, yes. - They want to read--
47:50 And it turns out it's, like, maybe the same.
47:52 - It's the same. - Totally.
47:54 That's like, "Oh, snap, we really are connected."
47:56 Do you ever have, like, a lyric that you feel, like,
47:58 is so personal that you're like, "They're not gonna--
48:01 like, should I change it? They're not gonna understand it,"
48:04 and then they get it in a way--
48:06 - They internalize it. - They see you.
48:08 What I was going to say was when you were talking
48:11 about almost kind of manifesting your own life
48:14 into the song, does anybody else feel that when you write,
48:17 you're almost manifesting things that are about to happen?
48:19 - Completely. - Yeah.
48:21 Like, when you're about to write something and you're like,
48:23 "Should I be putting this in a song?
48:25 'Cause I'm gonna be saying this a lot."
48:27 - Is this a self-fulfilling prophecy? - Yeah, exactly.
48:29 I feel that, like, so much.
48:31 I feel like I look back at songs
48:33 that I relate to now more than I ever did.
48:35 - When I write them. - Especially when I wrote them.
48:37 And some songs take on completely new meanings.
48:40 - That's-- - That's very real.
48:42 - That's what I said. - I think it's evidence
48:44 that songs come from the divine,
48:46 that sometimes they have things that we don't know.
48:48 - It's so true. - It's so true.
48:50 - We call it sometimes. - The mirrors.
48:52 - Like, we really call it. - It shows up.
48:54 - Hello, vessel.
48:56 (laughter)
48:58 I got something for you today.
49:00 I love what you said, really, about loving writing for movies.
49:04 And for me, I mean, I think I've only been doing it
49:07 for maybe two, three years, and it's a couple songs here and there,
49:10 and I really enjoy it,
49:13 because usually I'm in the thing
49:15 and having to write about the thing that I was in.
49:18 And so there's this weird sort of, like, double view
49:21 that I have to see through,
49:24 and then I have to filter what I've experienced,
49:27 what is in the thing,
49:29 into this singular moment for people to listen to.
49:35 But it feels like I'm exposing everything I've already been through
49:38 on the project that I've been through.
49:40 So it feels like my heart is beating on the outside of my chest.
49:43 - You're, like, naked. - Yeah.
49:45 But I love that. I love that.
49:47 The task is that.
49:49 And so there is no choice but to do that.
49:52 And the only way to do it so that people connect
49:54 is to be as naked and vulnerable as you possibly can.
49:57 I think you don't give yourself enough credit
49:59 for being as vulnerable as you are.
50:01 And just because your process is different to someone else's
50:03 it doesn't mean that it's not a process still.
50:05 You understand?
50:07 It takes you a year to get to the album that you want to get to.
50:10 It takes you a year to get to the album.
50:12 It doesn't mean it's over. It just means that you're taking time.
50:14 It's like building a battery up again.
50:16 - You know? That's just how it is. - Therapist.
50:19 - Yes. - Yeah.
50:21 So wise.
50:23 I also love, in terms of writing for film,
50:27 I love a challenge.
50:29 - Yeah. - I love a challenge.
50:31 Because you don't know what you're going to find.
50:33 And I love a, like, kind of get--
50:35 I love a not guarantee.
50:37 - Yes. - You know?
50:39 I don't know what's going to happen. I don't know.
50:41 I think for me, I've realized that, like,
50:45 my whole life is an act of service.
50:47 I feel the most, like, of purpose
50:51 when I can serve something or somebody.
50:53 So whether that's, like, an artist or a project,
50:57 like, I like being there for, like, the making of
51:01 and being a part of something
51:03 and knowing that, like, I got to, like, be there for it.
51:06 Like, that's such a beautiful thing.
51:08 I mean, you have been a part of so many songs.
51:11 They have a list of, like, some of the artists.
51:13 - Let's just do a flex. - Let's not.
51:15 - Look, Justin Bieber. - Oh, dear God.
51:17 Selena Gomez, Britney Spears, Lady Gaga,
51:20 Ed Sheeran, John Legend,
51:23 Shawn Mendes, Kelly Clarkson, Maroon 5,
51:26 - Pink, Kacey Musgraves, Shakira. - Her top 10.
51:29 - Shakina Aguilera. - Should I go somewhere else?
51:32 Keith Urban, Bibi Lovato, H.E.R.,
51:34 - Mariah Morris, Gwen Stefani, - Okay, okay.
51:36 - Nick Jonas, Gannon Shea, - My hands are so dirty.
51:38 - OneRepublic, Kelsey Ballerini, - Oh, my God.
51:40 - Linkin Park, Ben Platt, - Oh, my God.
51:42 - 5 Seconds of Summer, Fifth Harmony,
51:44 - Okay. - Kelly Steinsild,
51:46 Sabrina Carpenter, Little Mix, - Okay.
51:48 - Zedd, Rita Ora, The Fray, and also Dua Lipa.
51:51 - Yeah. - Working together.
51:52 - All time. - All time.
51:54 - And that's not even everyone. - So nice.
51:56 - My--my--my--why does that--
51:58 why is it hard for you to listen to that?
52:00 - Yeah, what is so--what's-- - I don't know.
52:03 I, like, I think I'm just so used to being, like,
52:06 in the background that, like, when--
52:08 like, when someone, like, wants to--
52:11 - Therapist. - I don't know.
52:13 - It, like, really-- - It really, like,
52:16 freaks me out. - I said this to another artist.
52:18 I said this to another artist before.
52:20 - But I love--I love what I do.
52:22 - It's really important for you-- - I deeply love it.
52:24 - We believe you. - It's really important for you
52:26 to be able to sit in the power of being able
52:28 to make other people's dreams come true as well.
52:31 That's a really special thing to--I know.
52:33 I know, but it's a really--but it's a really special
52:35 and singular talent that you have,
52:38 and you do yourself and the work you've done a disservice
52:41 to not just sit in it.
52:43 That's your work. - Yeah, I'm horrible with, like,
52:46 compliments, anything. - But it's yours.
52:48 - I'm, like, I just--I'm gonna be, like--
52:50 I just wanna be, like, a turtle. - But you deserve it all.
52:52 If you didn't work for it, it wouldn't come to you.
52:54 You deserve it. It's not you didn't do the work.
52:56 You did all of the work. - I feel bad for being talented.
52:59 - No, oh, my God, no. I just--I don't know.
53:02 I just--I, like--like I said, I'm in, like--
53:05 it's such an act of service. I'm not, like, good with people.
53:09 I, like--I just wanna be there for people.
53:12 - But you are. You're good for good with people.
53:14 You are. - But I think we--
53:16 we assume that an act of-- - Can we get off of being, like--
53:18 - No, but, like, I think it's so important
53:20 'cause I think we think that an act of service
53:22 doesn't include-- it doesn't include
53:24 acknowledging the work that we've done.
53:26 That is also an act of service
53:28 because if another young lady is watching you
53:31 take ownership of the stuff that you've done,
53:34 you're telling her that it's okay to take ownership
53:36 of the stuff that she's done. - Right.
53:38 - That is an act of service. - They, like, speak up on my throat.
53:40 - You know, I know. - To try and--
53:42 - And it's important. - Yeah.
53:44 - I think we don't, like--
53:46 I think we don't, like, take that into account.
53:48 It is important for other people to see us
53:50 'cause women, we don't do it enough
53:53 to say, "Yeah, I did do that, and I'm really proud of that,"
53:55 because another young lady's gonna look at you
53:57 and go, "Well, if she's okay with doing it,
53:59 "if I'm okay with doing it, then I'm okay,"
54:01 to say, "Yeah, I did that, and I'm really proud of it."
54:03 That is an act of service also.
54:05 It isn't arrogance to say,
54:07 "I'm really proud of the work I've done."
54:09 - And you've done it. - And you have.
54:11 - Oh. - Thanks. - And then some.
54:13 - Thanks. - Yeah.
54:15 - You're good. You're very good. - Yes.
54:17 - Okay, who else? Olivia?
54:19 [laughter]
54:21 - Hunger Games?
54:23 [laughter]
54:25 - You deserve it all. You're the greatest.
54:27 - Yeah.
54:29 - So we're close to wrapping up,
54:31 so we'll do some rapid-fire kind of fun questions.
54:33 - Okay. - So...
54:35 what's your go-to karaoke song?
54:37 - "Wannabe."
54:39 - "Spice Girls." - Oh, so good.
54:41 - Does that have a taste?
54:43 - "We Don't Need Another Hero," Tina Turner.
54:45 - Ooh. - Good.
54:47 - Mine's "Dancing Queen," Ava.
54:49 - Yes! - Ooh.
54:51 - That's a good one. - Ooh.
54:53 - I hate singing
54:55 at karaoke, so I do--
54:57 like, my friends hate it.
54:59 It's all a bit weird, but I do "Changes"
55:01 by Tupac. - Oh, yes!
55:03 That was in the barber shop the other day.
55:05 - Wow.
55:07 - "Lose Yourself." - Eminem.
55:09 - Nice. Good one.
55:11 - When he came out the Academy Awards a couple years ago
55:13 and did it, I was fired.
55:15 - That's crazy. - Yeah. How about you, Kayla?
55:17 - I've never done karaoke. - What?
55:19 - What? - And you looked at me like...
55:21 - No, because... - Not even in your--
55:23 - No, you did, but I don't like to sing.
55:27 [laughter]
55:29 - She was waiting for the rest of the sentence.
55:31 - The way you said it was great.
55:33 - Anyway, anyway.
55:35 - I've never done it. - No, not even at home
55:37 in, like, the fake mic?
55:39 - You know what? I had a karaoke, like,
55:41 speaker, like, box
55:43 when I was a kid. When I was, like,
55:45 six, and it had "We Are Family."
55:47 - Nice. - And I would sing
55:49 karaoke to that, and it had...
55:51 What is that NSYNC
55:53 song? - "It's Gonna Be Me."
55:55 - I don't know if it was that. I think it was
55:57 probably "It's Gonna Be Me." - Nice.
55:59 - It was that and that, and also...
56:01 - Like, don't.
56:03 - "I Hope You Dance."
56:05 - Oh, wow. - That's a great song.
56:07 - That's a good one, which is,
56:09 like, one of my favorite-- - "I Hope You Dance."
56:11 - Willmark? No. - Yeah.
56:13 - Yes, yes. - Yeah. - I think so.
56:15 I hope we're not wrong, but...
56:17 - Yeah, no, I did. - But "I Hope You Dance,"
56:19 "We Are Family," was, like, the main
56:21 karaoke one. But I've never done, like,
56:23 the, like, standing on a stage thing.
56:25 - Right! - We should do that, like, "Oh, no, wait."
56:27 - Yeah. - Yeah.
56:29 - That'd be bad for me. - Yeah.
56:31 - How intimidating to walk into karaoke
56:33 and it's Billie and Dua.
56:35 - Oh, God.
56:37 - I just feel like, haven't you
56:39 heard enough of music?
56:41 - I don't know. Like, I was at a party
56:43 and they had karaoke and they were like, "Billie, you should do it."
56:45 I was like, "You don't need me." - Crush it.
56:47 - It's never fun if the person can actually sing,
56:49 which is why I tend to just be like, "I'll watch."
56:51 - What about a dream collaboration?
56:53 - Oh, everyone here.
56:55 - There we go. - This right here.
56:57 - Oh, yeah. - A super song?
56:59 - Ha ha ha, yeah.
57:01 - We asked that she would show us.
57:03 - We did, like,
57:05 there was, um, we were on a
57:07 late-night TV show,
57:09 and I was asked to sing something,
57:11 and John was playing,
57:13 and I looked over and said, "Can you do this?"
57:15 - Yeah. - "Yeah, I can do this."
57:17 And I just, I loved that moment.
57:19 So I hope that I want to do it again.
57:21 And you, I'm chasing after you consistently.
57:23 - Ha ha ha.
57:25 - Like, you're all incredible, so
57:27 let me know.
57:29 - I remember the first time I heard you sing
57:31 on Broadway with my whole family.
57:33 Oh, my God.
57:35 Oh. Oh.
57:37 - Ha ha ha.
57:39 - It's insane.
57:41 - Yeah, that's the Holy Ghost.
57:43 Oh, my God!
57:45 Hey!
57:47 So, okay, I'm derailing the question.
57:49 - No, no, no, it's true, because, like,
57:51 even though things are not about awards,
57:53 I mean, this woman has won an Emmy, Tony, and Grammy
57:55 for the amazing
57:57 work in "The Color Purple."
57:59 It's like you bleed purple. - Mm-mm.
58:01 - Like, it's a gift that keeps on giving, but it's
58:03 your performance that has allowed you
58:05 to do that, 'cause you just killed it.
58:07 - Thank you. Thank you.
58:09 - Really thankful for all of you guys joining.
58:11 I mean, this is such a dope table.
58:13 We need to do this again. - Yeah.
58:15 - And "Friends" came in, but cheers to everyone here.
58:17 - Cheers to everyone. - Amazing songwriters.
58:19 - Gosh, with water.
58:21 - I know. - I'm not sure what water's really like.
58:23 - Water is life. It's fine.
58:25 - It's fine. - It's fine.
58:27 - It's fine. - All right.
58:29 - We're all good. - Cheers.
58:31 - I don't know about you, but I love seeing
58:33 so many talented women-- and a man--
58:35 come together in a beautiful, harmonious conversation.
58:39 Until next time, I'm Yvonne Orji,
58:41 and this is "Off Script" with a Hollywood reporter.
58:44 [music fades out]