ShaDon Brown 2023 Fall Camp Day 5
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00:00 And co-defense coordinator, Shadon Brown.
00:03 Questions for Coach Brown?
00:05 So, Shadon, start with your position.
00:08 On the depth chart in the press guide,
00:11 you got a lot of ores there.
00:13 So, how is the battle, I guess, five competing?
00:17 How's that going?
00:18 Yeah, it's a great problem to have.
00:20 For the first time since I've been here,
00:22 I feel like we have more than two guys
00:25 that you just really feel good about
00:26 running out there on the field.
00:29 I think all five of those guys, the three returners,
00:32 which is Andrew Wilson-Lamp,
00:34 who's a junior or a redshirt sophomore,
00:36 now has made an unbelievable jump just with physicality
00:39 and gained some weight to help him play
00:44 a lot stronger at this level.
00:45 And he came on a little bit down the stretch for us.
00:48 Obviously, Malachi Ruffin, who I call Steady Eddie,
00:50 who's been here for six years, and he knows every position.
00:53 And he's doing a great job in the leadership role.
00:56 I feel very comfortable putting him out there.
00:59 And the guy that's probably made the biggest jump in the room
01:01 is Jacoby Spills.
01:02 You know, Jacoby, last year, he was a little trial by fire,
01:07 and he was 177 pounds.
01:09 He probably was out there before he should have been,
01:11 but because of injuries,
01:13 if you put a freshman out there in the Big 12, it's difficult,
01:17 no matter what sport you're playing.
01:18 And he's really changed his body.
01:21 He's up to 187 pounds now.
01:23 He's one of the strongest.
01:24 He's over a 330-pound bench press guy for a freshman
01:29 that probably was benching 225 last year.
01:32 So that's a huge testament to Mike Joe
01:33 and his crew downstairs.
01:35 But those three guys have made really strong jumps.
01:38 And then, obviously, bringing in two transfer guys
01:42 with Montre Miller, who was here early on in the spring,
01:45 who's starting to get a good grasp of what we're doing.
01:50 He's a guy that I feel very comfortable
01:52 having out there at any point.
01:53 And then -- thank you, sir.
01:55 Then the guy that came in just this summer,
01:58 who's done an unbelievable job, is Beanie Bishop.
02:01 Just from a leadership standpoint, he's an alpha.
02:04 He's the alpha in the room.
02:06 He's already taken on the leadership role in the room.
02:09 For only being here two months,
02:10 you wouldn't think that would be the case.
02:12 But his personality is a leadership alpha personality.
02:15 He's done a great job, as well.
02:17 He really flashed today, as well.
02:20 What's going to be the decision-making for you?
02:23 Is it going to be the playmakers,
02:24 the guys that can make the plays,
02:26 or the guys that can avoid the mistakes or be consistent?
02:29 What does that rank in your --
02:31 Yeah, I think there's a balance of both.
02:32 I think you want guys out there that are not going to bust
02:36 and what I call give up layups.
02:39 But you also want guys out there that can make plays.
02:42 So if you can get a happy balance in there --
02:44 because, obviously, I always tell the guys,
02:45 if you grade out 100 percent but you never make any plays,
02:48 you're going to do a great job standing over there
02:50 with me coaching.
02:51 Because I need guys out there that are going to make plays.
02:53 And so we try to -- if guys are an M.A.
02:57 guy, they're not going to be on the grass.
03:00 And I feel good because I got five guys
03:02 that I can roll out there, and I feel really good
03:04 about any of those guys.
03:05 Like I finished today, Jacobi Spells didn't start out today
03:08 with the ones, but he finished the last two-minute
03:11 with the ones and made a key play in a two-minute scenario.
03:14 So I feel comfortable playing all five of those guys at corner.
03:17 Is it maybe that you can reap the rewards
03:20 of what you went through last year,
03:22 playing all those guys that maybe weren't ready,
03:24 that you had to because of the numbers
03:27 you were presented with?
03:28 Yes, definitely.
03:29 I think that playing time that those guys got
03:32 that they probably were not ready for
03:34 has really helped them make that jump a little bit faster
03:36 as they move into year two,
03:38 as well as guys like Malachi Ruffin,
03:40 who had been here for four or five years
03:42 but hadn't really been a contributor on defense
03:45 as much as he had in the special teams.
03:47 So I feel like those guys have made that jump
03:50 just because of experience
03:52 and also because they've gotten stronger.
03:54 That's one of the key things I talk with Coach Brown
03:57 a lot about is down the field,
03:59 it's kind of like if you watch basketball,
04:01 you watch a freshman basketball player
04:03 trying to box out versus a senior.
04:05 It's different.
04:06 Well, it's the same thing on a goal ball down the field,
04:08 and they're jockeying for position,
04:10 and you got a 170-pound freshman
04:13 gets knocked over by a 220-pound senior.
04:16 It's a little different ballgame.
04:18 Now I feel like we're stronger down the field.
04:20 We can handle those 50/50 matchups.
04:23 What do you find with those guys?
04:25 Do you think play inside and outside?
04:28 I think Beanie Bishop is probably more of a guy
04:31 that can combo and play inside at nickel and play outside.
04:35 We're working him at both of those.
04:38 Malachi Ruffin can go back and play deep safety
04:41 as well as corner.
04:43 I'm cross-training a couple of those guys,
04:45 but not all of them this year
04:46 just because we've got enough depth now.
04:50 I like cross-training, but now I feel like
04:52 because we've got depth at corner and safety
04:55 that I don't have to cross-train as much.
04:56 I can cross-train more for quality
04:59 more than just trying to create depth.
05:02 Getting back to the point you made about strong,
05:05 is there any value to having guys
05:06 who think they're stronger than maybe they actually are?
05:09 Do you buy into that a little bit, psychology?
05:12 Well, if you and I go to Planet Fitness
05:15 and lay under 300 pounds on the bench press,
05:17 we may think we can lift it,
05:18 but eventually we're going to have to lift it.
05:20 So I think confidence helps,
05:23 but eventually you have to go out and make those plays.
05:27 And it's usually not the first play when I'm fresh,
05:30 but now it's the second, third, fourth time
05:32 that I have to make those plays when I'm tired.
05:35 That strength really shows up.
05:37 And I think the maturity and the strength
05:39 that we've gained over the offseason
05:40 is going to help some of those guys be better,
05:42 especially down the field.
05:45 How big was it, like you're saying, with Beanie,
05:48 how big was it to get a leader in that group,
05:50 somebody to really be in charge of the group?
05:53 It was imperative that we found a guy
05:54 that could lead and had an alpha male mentality.
06:00 I didn't know that coming in,
06:01 that Beanie would be that this quick.
06:04 I knew he had those traits,
06:06 characteristic traits about him,
06:08 but he came in and he's a guy
06:11 that is going to hold people accountable,
06:14 but he's going to be accountable as well.
06:16 You know, if he makes a mistake,
06:17 he's going to own up to it and take ownership.
06:20 Something as simple as, you know,
06:21 if Coach Joe says, "Run through the line,"
06:24 off the field and the guy is a step before the line,
06:26 he's going to call him out.
06:28 And we've not always had that at times
06:30 because as young people in today's society,
06:33 everybody wants to be everybody's friend.
06:35 It's very difficult to correct somebody else that's your buddy
06:39 because you don't want to feel like that you're demeaning them
06:42 or making them look bad in front of others,
06:44 and young people just struggle with that, and he doesn't.
06:47 He will hold people accountable,
06:49 and again, he holds himself accountable,
06:51 and he will take ownership for any mistakes,
06:54 which I really love,
06:55 and he's been a pleasant surprise to have.
06:58 How does somebody toe that line
06:59 between being the brand-new guy in the room
07:02 and also not being hesitant to hold guys accountable
07:07 or maybe be unlikable?
07:09 Well, I think the first piece that you have to have
07:11 is you have to have consistency.
07:13 You know, when you walk in the room,
07:14 you have to have an aura about you,
07:16 but you have to have consistency,
07:17 and if you're consistent every single day,
07:20 doing it the right way and doing it
07:22 the best of your capabilities and other guys see that,
07:25 then it's a lot easier to lead.
07:27 But if you're what I call a real good feel-good guy,
07:29 you know, you wake up in the morning,
07:30 you got some good sleep, and all of a sudden,
07:32 you're ready to go and you're going hard,
07:35 and then the next day, you stayed up too late,
07:37 and now you're dragging.
07:39 You can't be a leader if you're not consistent.
07:41 And, you know, I tell the guys all the time,
07:43 you know, leadership's not fun sometimes.
07:45 No matter what profession you're in,
07:46 leadership's not fun because that means
07:48 you're going to have to call out and correct,
07:51 but you're also going to have to lead from the front as well.
07:54 And so he's done that, you know, in coming in here
07:57 and, you know, been here for, I guess, two months now.
08:00 He's been the same every day.
08:02 This development of Andrew Wilson-Lamb going long,
08:05 but I know he was really skinny, still seems skinny,
08:08 but where is he now?
08:10 Yeah, Andrew came in, I think, my first year here.
08:13 He was probably about --
08:16 he's going to cry when he hears this,
08:17 but he was probably 158 pounds, 6'1".
08:20 He was a beanpole, and he's now in the 177, 178 range.
08:26 For him, it doesn't look like a whole lot.
08:28 For you and I, it'd be a whole lot, right,
08:30 gaining 20 pounds, but he's done a really good job.
08:33 He's gotten stronger.
08:34 He's more confident because he is stronger.
08:37 You know, he always could run.
08:38 He can really run, and he can run for days.
08:40 He's one of those guys that does not get tired,
08:43 and he's made a huge jump.
08:45 You know, I think playing him a little bit down the stretch
08:47 last year gave him some confidence
08:50 going into this offseason to now come in with some confidence
08:53 that I can play at this level,
08:55 and he also utilized that few games
08:59 that he got to play to see where I need to get better
09:02 and continue to add weight,
09:03 continue to get stronger throughout the offseason.
09:05 He's done a good job of that, and he's playing at a high level.
09:09 I know takeaways last year was a direct correlation
09:12 of the inexperience that you had with all those men.
09:15 What's your message to them this year?
09:17 How do you go about talking to them about,
09:19 "We have to make more plays.
09:21 We have to create more turnovers and opportunities for y'all"?
09:24 Yeah, I make sure we're aware of last year,
09:28 but I don't dwell on it because you got a new group of guys.
09:32 Some guys were not here last year,
09:34 so we talk about it and explain why we're doing the things
09:39 that we're doing now as far as the adjustments
09:40 we've made to what we're doing,
09:43 but I don't harp on what we did as much last year
09:47 other than, "Hey, guys, this was an issue last year.
09:50 This is why we're doing it this way to get it fixed,"
09:54 and I think more than anything is alignment,
09:57 getting aligned, playing harder,
10:00 and then being able to execute,
10:01 and I think that's where we've made strides
10:04 throughout the offseason as a defensive staff.
10:07 That's really all we've done is focused on alignment
10:11 and effort across the board and physicality.
10:15 We've done more drills to where we're full speed
10:17 and being more physical, and I promise you it'll show up.
10:20 So the number one thing is getting in place
10:22 to get the turnover, and then the next thing is executing
10:25 and actually physically doing it.
10:26 Yes. If you don't get in position,
10:28 you're probably not going to make the play
10:30 because you're always running to where your responsibility is.
10:33 A lot of that is communication.
10:34 A lot of that is knowing your job
10:38 and feeling comfortable with everybody around you as well
10:41 that you don't have to overcompensate for somebody.
10:44 Maybe they don't know their job as well.
10:46 I feel like the puzzle pieces are fitting all together.
10:49 You're 1/11 of the defense.
10:50 You can go out and do it because you know the guy next to you
10:53 knows exactly what he's doing as well.
10:56 Jumping back to Beanie and being an alpha,
10:59 if he was productive throughout his time
11:00 in Western Kentucky, but especially that last month,
11:03 month and a half, it seemed like every time
11:05 he was out there, he was making a game-changing play.
11:07 How much can a stretch of football like that
11:09 change the trajectory of a guy's career?
11:11 Well, you know, making plays is sometimes contagious.
11:15 I think when you start to make a few plays,
11:18 it gives you confidence, and a lot of times
11:20 it's kind of like a guy in basketball.
11:22 You say, "Man, he's on fire." It's very similar.
11:25 You get that confidence to go make plays,
11:27 and you don't play with a caution.
11:29 You play with a reckless abandon,
11:31 and that allows you to make more plays.
11:33 I think, you know, Beanie transferred
11:36 from Western Kentucky to Minnesota.
11:39 He had a different role in their scheme,
11:42 and then him transferring here,
11:45 he's got multiple roles in this scheme,
11:47 and so he's allowed to play free,
11:49 and I know he's going to make some mistakes
11:51 because it's a new defense, but he's the kind of guy
11:53 that he can make a mistake because he takes ownership
11:56 and shake it off and move on to the next play,
11:58 which is positive.
12:01 Ultimately, I mean, I know this is way, way too early,
12:05 but do you envision sticking with two guys at corner
12:08 and running them as long as they can go,
12:10 or do you want to rotate maybe all five?
12:12 Yeah, we've got depth. We're going to play all five.
12:15 If guys have shown the ability to play at this level
12:18 in this league, we're going to play all five,
12:21 and I feel like they've earned that.
12:24 I feel like you can't create depth
12:26 if you don't play them, especially early,
12:28 and I think last year, you know,
12:31 we had the injuries really early, 12 plays into the year,
12:36 to our best player back there,
12:38 which really caused a little bit of a panic,
12:40 and I think now we have enough depth
12:43 and we've built enough depth that we could put any of those
12:45 five out there at corner and feel good about those guys.
12:49 You know, back to his maybe five years ago,
12:52 you couldn't do that with the tempo
12:53 and all the different things that were in this league,
12:55 but now the way the league has changed
12:58 a little bit scheme-wise,
13:00 you could probably get away with that if you had to.
13:03 Yeah, and this league is becoming more
13:05 of a personnel-driven league, and when I say personnel,
13:08 you know, teams will play with one back and one tight end,
13:11 and then they will change to one back and two tight ends,
13:14 and then they'll go to no tight ends,
13:16 and so because of the change in personnel,
13:18 when the offense subs, we can sub,
13:20 so we're able to play different packages because of that,
13:24 but also it's not as up-tempo every game
13:27 like it's been in the past in this league.
13:30 Teams will slow down because teams are going to try
13:32 to run the football some, especially if they get a lead,
13:35 they're going to try to run the football some,
13:36 so you can play more guys because of that,
13:39 and I think you need to play more to get ready for guys
13:42 that are going to tempo every snap, like a Texas Tech
13:45 is going to try to run 100 snaps,
13:46 and if you're playing two guys at corner
13:49 and two guys at safety the whole game,
13:51 you know, by the second half, it's a tough sled.
13:56 After those top five guys,
13:58 who are some of the younger guys that are standing out to you?
14:00 Yeah, one pleasant surprise has been Jordan Jackson.
14:04 You know, Jordan Jackson is a guy
14:05 that played running back in high school,
14:08 and Jordan Jackson was a pure projection,
14:10 so I had him in camp, I worked him out in camp,
14:14 and I always knew he could run.
14:15 He was a consistent 4'5", 40 guy.
14:18 Three times in a row, he ran under 4'6" in the 4'5" range,
14:23 so I knew he could run, and then just getting him here,
14:26 he was also a late guy.
14:27 He came in in June,
14:29 and he's done a really good job picking it up.
14:31 He can run.
14:32 He's picked up the terminology of just playing defense
14:35 because he played offense.
14:36 He was a starting running back for the last two years
14:39 at Fairfield Central there in Ohio,
14:41 so he didn't play a lot of defense,
14:43 and he's been a pleasant surprise
14:45 with just being able to cover and how he moves in space.
14:48 He's going to be a guy that I think can help us
14:49 on special teams this year.
14:52 I don't know if he'll be ready for prime time
14:54 on defense early on, but I think as the year goes,
14:58 he'll get some snaps under his belt on special teams
15:00 and be able to contribute for us this year.
15:04 Hey, Shadon, go back to the second line.
15:07 You said if you ran out 100%,
15:09 you're probably not going to be a very good player.
15:11 That kind of seems funny, but I guess that makes sense to guys,
15:13 but they're still conditioned to not make mistakes
15:15 because the spotlight is so bright in that position.
15:17 But you kind of have to talk them into making mistakes,
15:21 I guess, so to speak.
15:22 Do they get that, or does that take some proof in film?
15:25 Well, I think it takes some film,
15:28 and what I mean by if they grade out 100%,
15:30 they didn't play very well, that's not what I mean.
15:32 If you grade out 100%,
15:34 but you never take risks or go make plays,
15:37 then now you're not playing aggressive.
15:39 You're playing passive, and so the aggressive nature
15:43 that we want to play with at every ball
15:45 that's thrown is our ball.
15:47 There's going to be times when you don't make the play.
15:50 You know, the offense has scholarship players, too.
15:52 So, you know, if you go out there
15:54 and never go attack the ball
15:56 and never go try to make those plays,
15:58 then you're trying to play safe,
16:00 then you're probably not ever going to be a playmaker.
16:02 But if there's a guy who, you know,
16:04 seven out of ten times he does it right,
16:07 and three times he has a minus
16:08 because he tried to go attack the ball, I'm okay with that
16:11 because I know that those -- if he makes those plays,
16:14 one out of those three,
16:16 he's changed the game for our entire team.
16:18 And, you know, we all know what happens
16:20 when there's a turnover, the entire sideline erupts,
16:24 the stadium is excited, that creates momentum,
16:27 and that's what we need to help our offense.
16:31 Is it just as simple as aggressiveness
16:33 that you're bringing up there in terms of grading the team
16:36 on the ability to create more turnovers?
16:38 Because that was an emphasis toward the end of last year
16:40 and this year now, but aside from actually
16:42 getting a turnover, how do you evaluate that?
16:47 Well, the more confidence that you have,
16:50 the more aggressive you will be because you know your job,
16:52 you know what to do, you know where to go.
16:55 If you attack the ball,
16:57 whether you're making a tackle as a linebacker or a safety
17:00 or you're attacking the ball in the area outside as a corner,
17:03 to me it's all the same.
17:04 The aggressiveness comes from being confident
17:06 in what you're doing, all right,
17:08 and knowing your job so that you can go make those plays.
17:11 And through film study, we watch guys on film,
17:13 and you can see real clearly a guy that plays on his heels
17:17 and a guy that's playing with his pads forward.
17:19 A guy with his pads forward, he's going to attack.
17:21 A guy that's on his heels, he's passive.
17:23 And so those guys are not going to make tackles,
17:26 they're not going to make plays on the ball,
17:27 and that's not what we're hunting right now.
17:29 We're hunting guys that are going to go attack.
17:32 You know, that nothing to lose mentality.
17:35 Go get it, don't sit back on your heels
17:37 and really take the fight to the offense
17:40 as opposed to receiving it.
17:42 With your grading, is everything equal,
17:44 or are things more valuable than others?
17:48 I think really everything's equal
17:50 from an assignment alignment standpoint,
17:54 but from a production standpoint,
17:56 you know, interception is a lot more production point
18:01 than making a tackle.
18:03 But if I make a tackle for a loss,
18:05 we bring a blitz with a DB coming on a blitz,
18:08 and he makes a tackle for a loss,
18:10 well, that's more valuable than a tackle
18:12 after they caught the ball for 12 yards down the field.
18:15 We do chart something that we do here now,
18:18 is we chart strip attempts and hands-on balls.
18:21 And I stole that years ago from Rick Pitino.
18:25 I'm a Kentucky guy, so Rick Pitino,
18:28 when he was a basketball coach at the University of Kentucky,
18:30 used to chart hands-on balls,
18:33 you know, the back tips and all those things.
18:35 We do the same thing, so guys that have strip attempts
18:39 on a ball carrier, you know, the guy may broke a run,
18:42 but he may be 40 yards down the field.
18:44 We should be sprinting, and that's an opportunity
18:47 to make one of those game-changing plays
18:49 from behind.
18:50 And you know those are morale killers
18:52 for an offensive player,
18:54 but they're great boosts for a defensive player.
18:55 So we practice that, and we chart it,
18:57 and we show the kids every day who did that.
19:00 And the more you see guys, the guys that have the attempts
19:03 are usually the guys that have the turnovers cost.
19:06 And so that's what we talk about, the ball is money.
19:09 You know, you got to make plays on the ball to make --
19:12 you know, to win games, obviously, to be all-conference,
19:15 to be all-American, to get drafted.
19:17 You need to make plays on the ball.
19:18 And so we talk about the ball is money.
19:20 Every time you make a play on the ball,
19:22 these guys sitting in these seats in here right now
19:24 are going to write about you.
19:25 If you don't make plays on the ball,
19:26 they're not going to write about you.
19:27 And so that's the key to -- if you're making those plays,
19:30 we're probably going to win games.
19:33 Take Malachi and how he's developed over --
19:36 I mean, longer than you have been here.
19:40 Yeah, Malachi is a guy that -- unbelievable story.
19:45 No stars.
19:48 Shame on Keenan.
19:50 Didn't rate him.
19:52 Nobody recruited him.
19:54 Came to West Virginia because he wanted to be a Mountaineer.
19:57 Came out for the school tryout.
20:00 When school started, came out and ran,
20:02 and the previous staff brought him on to the team.
20:04 He was a walk-on player, obviously.
20:07 Was on the scout team for two years.
20:10 Didn't play a lot at all.
20:12 I came in in '21, and he did an unbelievable job.
20:16 And I basically explained to him,
20:17 his only opportunity was special teams because he is fast.
20:21 He's a 4'4" guy.
20:22 He can really run,
20:23 and his opportunity was going to be on special teams.
20:26 And he did a great job, earned a scholarship
20:30 because of special teams.
20:31 And then last year, being a utility player,
20:35 he was thrown into a ballgame against Baylor.
20:37 Had not had a rep at corner for probably three weeks.
20:41 And we had two injuries and had a targeting,
20:44 and we were down to our fourth or fifth guy,
20:46 and we were thin as nickel soup as far as who we had.
20:51 And so I go over and say, "Hey, Malachi, you got to go, man."
20:54 And he didn't bat an eye.
20:55 He was kind of blinking like, "At safety?"
20:58 I said, "No, bro, you got to go at corner."
21:00 And he goes out there and makes a couple plays
21:03 in that Baylor game and saves a touchdown on a big post ball
21:07 down on the hospital end.
21:09 Was a huge play, and that kind of ignited him.
21:12 And he ended up playing pretty consistent for us,
21:16 you know, at times throughout the year.
21:17 Had a couple games where he didn't play as well.
21:20 But you're talking about a guy who's been here for five years
21:23 who had never really played on defense at all.
21:25 And so now coming back as a six-year player,
21:28 he's really confident.
21:29 He knows his job.
21:31 He plays really hard.
21:33 He can play multiple positions, even without practice.
21:36 He can play on all four special teams.
21:38 He's one of those guys that you probably don't write
21:41 a lot of articles about,
21:42 and you're probably not going to get a lot of clicks
21:43 with his name.
21:45 But as a coach, you're always looking for him
21:47 because you know that if there's a hole, he can fill it.
21:50 He's kind of like the --
21:51 you know, you see that commercial Flex Seal.
21:53 You know, he can fix stuff.
21:55 And so that's why I love Malachi, and I'm just proud of him.
21:57 He's graduated. He's working on his Master's.
22:00 Great story.
22:01 You explained the mistake at Oklahoma State.
22:04 We talked to him before.
22:06 Can you give us your PG version of what you said to him,
22:10 then how he bounced back later in that game?
22:12 I told him I love him.
22:14 That's what I told him, in a different way.
22:17 But I was very upset with Malachi.
22:19 He did a great job of coming back after that.
22:22 As you guys who were at the game or saw the game,
22:24 he made that play which made the Knot top ten.
22:27 But then he went down in the last drive of the game,
22:30 they threw the ball at him three straight times,
22:31 and he made three straight plays.
22:32 And if he don't make them, we don't win
22:34 because we're only up five.
22:36 And, you know, that's a big --
22:38 that's a big moment for a kid to go from being in the lowest
22:41 of low to being in the highest of highs.
22:44 And I think, you know, that's who he is.
22:47 When I say Steady Eddie, I'm talking about demeanor,
22:50 poise, all those things.
22:51 He does not get too high, and he doesn't get too low.
22:55 And that's why he was able to come back and battle
22:57 and make those plays down the stretch for us
23:00 to beat Oklahoma State for the first time
23:03 in who knows how long.
23:06 That's probably the first call to set,
23:07 saying, "I'm going to take some quick quarterback."
23:09 Yeah, short memory. You got to have short memory.
23:12 You know, it's kind of -- you usually don't get re-dos,
23:16 but, you know, when the ball comes your way,
23:18 you got to go compete.
23:20 If you don't make the play,
23:22 you got to go right back the next snap
23:24 because they're coming back at you.
23:26 And if you make that play the next one,
23:28 then they won't come back to you as often.
23:30 But it's a short memory playing defensive back,
23:32 and you're going to make some, you're going to miss some,
23:34 but you got to keep playing.
23:35 And if you keep playing and keep having confidence in yourself,
23:38 you have a chance to make more plays.
23:40 But it's a hard position. It's kind of like O-line.
23:42 You know, DB and O-line is very similar.
23:44 You know, four guys can do their job.
23:46 One guy doesn't, it's a sack on the O-line, right?
23:50 DB, you got three guys doing their job,
23:52 and one guy falls down or whatever it may be,
23:56 and you give up a touchdown,
23:57 and you guys are going to write an article
23:59 that says the secondary sucks, and one guy slipped and fell,
24:02 and all the other three guys were great.
24:05 It's no different on the offensive line, right?
24:06 We all got to work in unison and work together,
24:09 and there's going to be good plays and bad plays.
24:13 You just got to have more good than bad.
24:17 I was going to ask what Keishon can do for you.
24:20 He's doing a bunch of different things.
24:21 What can't he do back there?
24:22 Yeah, Keishon Cobb is a guy
24:25 that can play multiple positions as well.
24:27 Keishon is really a nickel-spear kind of guy
24:33 when he was at Buffalo, and then we brought him in.
24:36 We knew he could play down in the apex,
24:40 but we didn't know if he could play deep safety at all.
24:43 He's been really a pleasant surprise
24:45 being able to play the ball in the deep part of the field.
24:47 You wouldn't think that he's a shorter, stocky guy.
24:50 He's a 5'10", probably 208 to 210 guy,
24:54 but he can really play the ball.
24:55 He's got good ball skills.
24:57 He's learning our scheme,
24:59 and we can play him at multiple positions right now,
25:01 and he's been a great addition because he can do that,
25:04 and he's a physical guy.
25:06 Like when he strikes, I mean, you hear it on the sideline.
25:09 He's going to be a great addition as well.
25:12 He gives us depth to play nickel
25:14 as well as play deep safety.
25:16 Wilson just a cap right now because he got here later.
25:22 Maybe he can grow into something else.
25:24 Yeah, Ant is playing free safety right now.
25:26 He's playing free, and he's a dude.
25:30 Ant is a guy that had over 100 tackles at Georgia Southern,
25:34 led them in tackles last year,
25:35 which is probably not a good thing
25:36 if your safety leads your team in tackles,
25:38 but he is a physical joker,
25:41 and when he pulls his pin, he goes,
25:44 and he's done a great job.
25:46 He's blended in well.
25:47 You guys will get a chance to be around him.
25:49 He's really serious, so don't take that personal.
25:53 He's locked in.
25:54 There's not a lot of smiles.
25:55 Like he's a focused dude, and that's been good.
25:59 That's been good for our room
26:00 because he's raised the level of play of people around him.
26:03 I'm just really proud of the transfers we brought in.
26:05 We do a really long vetting process,
26:08 sometimes too long for my liking with Coach Brown at times,
26:11 but he's really diligent in who we bring into the fold
26:16 because we don't want people to destroy the culture
26:19 that we have set, and I think our culture's much,
26:21 much better, and we've kind of said that
26:23 over the last couple years,
26:24 but it's taken another step this year, I promise you,
26:27 and we've brought guys in that have blended well,
26:29 and we've brought guys in that have enhanced the culture
26:33 pretty quickly with just their focus and their maturity.
26:36 Got a question.
26:37 I asked what your answer was to this.
26:39 How much you guys did?
26:41 Yeah, I think we've hit, especially with the secondary,
26:43 I think we've hit on all of those guys.
26:45 Those three that we brought in, I think we hit on all three
26:48 because they can do multiple things.
26:50 They're all physical guys,
26:52 and they all can play the ball in the air,
26:54 but they all are workers,
26:56 and they are guys that have blended in really well
26:59 and kind of learned the way we do things
27:02 and the roles that they've been given early on.
27:05 For example, I've told Beanie Bishop
27:07 he's a guy that has to be a leader.
27:09 He's an alpha male personality.
27:11 He has taken and ran with that.
27:14 Anthony Wilson is more of a cerebral guy
27:16 who's a really focused, laser-focused guy.
27:19 Well, that's a characteristic
27:21 that you can pass on to a younger player
27:23 to come in and watch film, and here's an example.
27:27 I leave out of the staff room at 1030 the other night,
27:30 and I walk down the hall, and Anthony Wilson's
27:32 in the safety room watching film at 10 o'clock at night.
27:35 Now, he's not required to be here.
27:36 I promise you, there's all these rules, right?
27:39 And I'm like, "What in the world is he doing in there?"
27:41 It kind of scared me, but that's him,
27:43 and he's not going to say anything.
27:45 He's watching the film,
27:47 and he's trying to get ahead on the installs
27:49 because he knows things are coming.
27:51 He wanted to watch the film from the spring
27:53 to see what he's supposed to do on each one of those calls,
27:56 and so that's an area where now you see the freshmen start to --
28:01 You look up at 6 o'clock in the afternoon after dinner.
28:04 You see three freshmen, Anthony Wilson.
28:06 We're not telling them to do that,
28:08 but we've brought in the right type of people,
28:09 and now guys gravitate toward them.
28:12 You mentioned that evaluation process.
28:13 Everyone probably just thinks it's, you know,
28:15 you go out and find guys.
28:17 How hard is that from your perspective?
28:20 And obviously, there's a lot more to it,
28:21 as you mentioned, just outside of just playing on the field.
28:24 Yeah, well, there's a system that everybody uses now.
28:27 It's called PFF.
28:29 It either promotes you or exposes you, all right,
28:31 for the good or the better because it has every play
28:33 you ever played in, and it's an NFL system.
28:36 The NFL uses it.
28:38 That's where they scout guys from the NFL level.
28:40 So if a guy played as a freshman on the gunner on the punt team
28:44 as a true freshman, but he's a senior,
28:46 that rep is going to be there.
28:47 And so we go out. We watch those guys.
28:49 They go into the portal. We watch them, and we say,
28:52 "Okay, does his skill set fit our needs?"
28:55 And then once we look at that and say,
28:57 "Yes," now what's the character piece?
29:00 Now we make calls to maybe there's somebody on that staff
29:04 that we know. Maybe it's a strength coach.
29:06 Maybe it's an academic person, somebody that knows that kid.
29:10 And then we go back as far as to, all right,
29:12 what area did he play high school football in, okay?
29:15 Anthony Wilson, he's from South Carolina.
29:17 Well, I spent five years at Wofford College
29:19 and off-season with the Panthers,
29:22 so the Carolinas I know.
29:23 So I can make phone calls to the Carolinas,
29:25 the people that I know that are not at Georgia Southern,
29:29 and find out about this young man.
29:31 Same thing with Montre Miller. What about this guy?
29:33 How is he off the field?
29:35 Does he love football? And get all those things,
29:38 and there's guys that we pass on,
29:40 and there's guys we say, "Okay, he checks the boxes."
29:42 Let's bring him in on a visit.
29:45 We bring him in on a visit, and we're still vetting that person
29:48 and his family to see if they're going to be a fit
29:51 for what we need them for as their role,
29:54 but are they going to come in and be a good person
29:57 to put in our locker room?
29:58 And so that's all a piece of it,
30:00 and we've had guys that we brought in on visits,
30:03 and we said, "Hey, we appreciate your time,
30:06 but we went on a date, but we're not going to get married.
30:09 You know, we're not going to do it."
30:10 And it's always, you know, it's small things,
30:12 and that's the hardest thing as a coach and a recruiter,
30:15 to take the things that you see, the subtle hints,
30:20 and go, "We can't take that guy,"
30:23 because a lot of times it's kind of like dating, right?
30:25 You know, she looks real pretty, and you go,
30:27 "Man, she can't cook very well,"
30:28 and then you wait until you get married and say,
30:30 "Man, she don't cook very well. Well, it's too late."
30:33 Well, that's kind of how I look at it.
30:35 You got to make sure that you say and see those things,
30:38 and you're honest with yourself, and say,
30:42 "No, that guy's not good for us."
30:44 And sometimes that's hard,
30:45 because what are you trying to do?
30:46 You're trying to fill your roster,
30:48 but if you fill it with the wrong people,
30:50 and we've all made mistakes doing that,
30:53 you fill it with the wrong people,
30:54 then everything you built can be torn down
30:56 immediately by one person,
30:57 especially if that young man's an alpha.
30:59 If he's an alpha, he can get people to gravitate toward him,
31:02 and it's either going to be positive or negative,
31:05 and we want to bring in the guys
31:06 that are going to enhance our culture.
31:09 Yeah, hopefully all your wives can cook.