"Don't want to make assumptions like him," Asad Umar's reaction on Shabbar Zaidi's statements
"Don't want to make assumptions like him," Asad Umar's reaction on Shabbar Zaidi's statements
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00:00 What were the reasons that you were removed from your first ministry in 2019?
00:06 I have answered this question many times.
00:11 The people of Pakistan had given Imran Khan a mandate.
00:16 Imran Khan had expectations and responsibility.
00:21 He had the complete authority to choose the team to play for.
00:31 Imran Khan felt that this change could improve the performance.
00:36 He changed it.
00:38 I don't know why they are looking for the real reasons for 4 years.
00:41 I can't comment on Bajwa sir.
00:43 Either Bajwa sir or Imran Khan can comment on it.
00:49 I have known Shabbar Zaidi for 30 years.
00:56 He is a good professional.
00:58 I asked him in a tweet yesterday if he is doing well.
01:03 It is a bit technical but allow me to tell you.
01:06 The amount of money that we had at that time,
01:09 when I was removed from the ministry,
01:13 was a little more than 9 billion dollars.
01:16 The last month's report was 8.7 billion dollars.
01:23 A few months ago, the state bank's savings were less than 3 billion dollars.
01:30 Despite that, we did not default on our foreign loans.
01:35 How were we going to default on 8.7 billion dollars?
01:39 The minimum level of our savings in the government of Tariq-e-Insaf was 7.2 billion dollars.
01:49 We never reached that level of savings.
01:52 I am shocked that this is a default level.
01:55 Allow me 30 seconds more.
01:57 It is a bit technical but the international funds
02:00 are not run by Imran Khan, Maria Mimman or the Pakistani establishment.
02:07 Everything is run by them.
02:09 The international funds are run by the people who take foreign loans.
02:14 The loans are in danger of not being able to repay.
02:17 For that, insurance premiums are sold.
02:20 If you are in danger of defaulting,
02:23 the premiums increase and the price increases.
02:27 If your risk is less, it decreases.
02:29 When the government of Tariq-e-Insaf came,
02:31 when Wazir Azam Imran Khan and Asad Umar became the minister of treasury,
02:34 the premium was 4.6% of the loans in the international market.
02:40 When the change came in April, the premium was 3.3%.
02:45 The risk was less than what we took.
02:49 When the vote of no confidence came, the premium was 5% less.
02:55 When the vote of no confidence came, the premium was 8% in 4 days.
03:03 Do you know where the premium went in October?
03:07 It went above 50%.
03:09 The real risk of defaulting is in the international markets.
03:13 As I said, the international markets are not run by politics.
03:15 They are completely reckless.
03:17 You have given the full context.
03:19 I want to ask you a question.
03:25 Khan sir called you and said that we are going to default.
03:29 You said that you know.
03:31 Did you get a call?
03:33 Did you talk to him?
03:35 I am sorry, I have no words to tell him.
03:41 I did not get a call.
03:48 I told you in detail that when there is no risk of default,
03:52 why would I call you?
03:54 And you are saying that 3 days ago.
03:56 Do you know what happened 3 days ago?
03:58 I came back from Washington.
04:00 I finished the negotiations with IMF.
04:02 And we had an agreement with IMF.
04:04 The Pakistan media has reported this in great detail.
04:08 You must know that when Sheikh Afeeq came,
04:10 Mr. Yunus Daga, the finance secretary,
04:14 told the Prime Minister that Asad Umar had finalized the deal in Washington.
04:22 Why are we giving more concessions?
04:24 We can get verification from there that we have a deal with IMF.
04:28 We have 8.7 billion dollars in reserves.
04:30 We have a deal with IMF.
04:32 Why would I say that it is going to default?
04:34 I don't know what Shabbarbhai remembers.
04:36 The second thing he said,
04:38 which is also very interesting,
04:40 that the way Mr. Tareen Shaukat used to run the economy,
04:44 as a result, your party did not even get 5% vote.
04:48 If your government had gone in an organic way,
04:52 if it had completed its term,
04:54 as the economic leaders were indicating at that time,
04:56 then your politics would have ended.
04:58 I told you how our government worked in the beginning.
05:02 The external loss that we had,
05:08 when we got the government from the PDM,
05:10 from the Muslim League Noon,
05:12 was a 33% greater loss than the economic growth that we left for them.
05:18 Despite that, what was the situation?
05:21 Your economy grew by 5.8% in one year,
05:25 then next year it grew by 6.1%.
05:28 Your exports, which were very low in the five years of the Muslim League Noon,
05:36 in those four years, an increase of $8 billion was made.
05:40 Your remittances, which come from outside Pakistan,
05:45 increased by more than $12 billion.
05:47 Your industries, which were more than 10%,
05:52 were growing by 12-12.5%.
05:55 The profits earned in your agriculture,
05:59 in those two years, are more than the history of Pakistan.
06:02 Pakistan's IT exports were $1.2-1.3 billion.
06:05 Mr. Shabbarth must have this number too.
06:07 Why are they claiming this now?
06:10 Let me ask you this question.
06:12 They can answer this.
06:15 What is your political reading?
06:18 I don't want to be as pessimistic as them.
06:22 They will answer this.
06:25 They talked about the performance again.
06:29 Let me tell you two things.
06:31 Imran Khan left inflation at 13.4%.
06:35 That inflation reached 36.4%.
06:38 That is almost three times more than the government's PDM.
06:42 Who would have gotten the vote?
06:44 The risk of foreign loans, of Diwali,
06:48 was less than 5% when we got the vote of no confidence.
06:52 I am not a politician.
06:57 I am a technocrat.
06:59 I am answering in a technical way.
07:01 The claims they made about the first year of our government,
07:06 and when our government ended,
07:08 both of those claims,
07:10 are not valid on the basis of facts and technical details.
07:15 Let's take the technocrat point forward.
07:17 As a technocrat,
07:18 he says that he was shocked when we had to stop our technical decisions
07:22 because of those political decisions.
07:25 For example,
07:26 he said that Imran Khan was scared of Maulana Fazlur Rehman's protest.
07:29 He said that he was scared that the tax would be deferred
07:32 and that the problem would not arise later.
07:34 Was Maulana Fazlur Rehman's protest a political challenge for you?
07:41 Was your government really scared?
07:44 I returned to the cabinet after Maulana Fazlur Rehman's protest.
07:49 You know that I was not in the cabinet for 8 months.
07:51 I returned to the cabinet on November 18.
07:54 This protest took place in December.
07:56 The government team that was formed,
07:58 I was also a part of it.
08:01 I used to go to the PDM and negotiate with them for the protest.
08:05 Imran Khan was so scared of the protest,
08:07 that the protest against the Quran ban in Sweden,
08:14 which was first called upon by Imran Khan and then by the Prime Minister,
08:18 Shahbaz Sharif,
08:19 was called upon by the PM.
08:20 The PM was arrested and was in jail for 3 weeks.
08:24 Such a big protest took place there.
08:26 No one was arrested,
08:27 no one was charged,
08:29 no one was tried.
08:31 The PM told the CDA chairman to go and ask them
08:34 if they needed any help.
08:38 Politically, I can tell you that no one was scared.
08:42 I will say two things about the politics they spoke about.
08:46 They said that they could not take tax decisions on a political basis.
08:50 They quoted 3 examples.
08:52 First, the tobacco mafia,
08:54 that your MPAs came,
08:56 then the MNAs came with Shah Mehmood Qureshi.
09:00 Third, they said that when real estate was taxed,
09:04 calls were made from there as well.
09:05 Then calls were made from Balochistan.
09:07 These were all political decisions,
09:09 not to impose taxes on them.
09:11 I will say two things about this.
09:14 First, do politicians represent the demands of their constituents?
09:25 Do they tell them to come and meet them?
09:28 Of course they do.
09:29 It is the rule of the world.
09:31 You have to make the decisions,
09:32 you listen to them.
09:34 If they only brought a delegation and said,
09:36 listen to their issues as well,
09:38 and we feel that their words have weight,
09:40 then this is not a unique thing.
09:42 Did the PM put pressure on them?
09:45 I cannot say,
09:46 Shabbar Zaidi and the PM can tell you
09:49 that what Shabbar is saying,
09:50 that it happened between them.
09:52 But for 8 months, I was the Minister of Treasury.
09:54 I was the Minister of Treasury until a few days before Shabbar became the FBR chairman.
09:58 FBR comes under the Ministry of Treasury.
10:01 I can only tell you that in those 8 months,
10:04 not once did the PM call me,
10:08 or call me for a meeting,
10:09 or put any political pressure on me to not do this,
10:14 because it would have made the MNA or MPA unhappy.
10:19 I did not do this for 8 months.
10:20 So, Mr. Asad, Zari Tax is not allowed?